The main problem is not that it doesnāt have a heating element but also u canāt take the brew chamber out of the machine and put it on a kettle because itās connected to the whole machine. Idk why did they do that tbh but maybe to make people look at the 58x as the sweet spot or idk. With 49 mm basket it will be a nightmare to find a blind basket too. Ih and btw they donāt give u a mirror too sooooo + i was gonna get this machine but because u wonāt be able to get many accessories i think i will buy a robot or 58x instead
Yeah i know that but tbh when i saw lance review and how he liked it i thought that yeah maybe this is the one. Yeah it has some problem, but it looks much better than the robot for me. Itās not a bad machine at all itās great and the heating problem is not a big issue for me(robot has the same problem) and with 49 mm and that price..yeah pull the trigger man
Either a used flair 58, gaggia classic, or any legit E61 portafilter style machine should be good. Disregard any other answers. The cheapo machines will have something fail and it will be impossible to replace.
I was in your situation a few years ago and went for a flair 58 lever machine and Niche Zero. Steep lewarning curve coming from zero experience but have been using it since with good success. For milk, I use the sub minimal nanotechnology former pro.
Workflow is oddly personal so let me preface: I like simple workflows. I want to wake up to preheated machine, grind, slam a portafilter in, brew, and knock. My Flair Pro rarely comes out because I find the whole process to be a little too fussy for most days.
So far, the workflow has been an adjustment but it is not nearly as fussy as my flair. I've needed to retrain my routine a bit. Youāre single dosing water and purging afterwards, but Iām finally getting used to it. Sometimes the machine will be on and I'll start grinding/puck prep, insert the portafilter, and then realize I haven't added the water yet, which means I'm then waiting 2-3 minutes for heating which is tedious.
TLDR: Workflow is fine but there are extra steps that you will be worrying about.
Proponents will say: Fussy workflow is the cost of using a machine with less moving parts which requires less maintenance. I don't think we should be considering that until we know how this thing will age in 2-3 years time
Appreciate it! I wouldnāt have bought my baratza encore during COVID if I knew what a sickness it would become.
To answer your question: today, probably notā¦ thereās just too many unknowns, especially around how long itās going to last and what kind of support there will be. I would have a hard time recommending it today for $2k+ when you can get the flair 58 for $700.
In a couple years when thatās all proven out, then maybe. Assuming you (1) will frequently tinker and make use of the different profiles, (2) rarely make milk drinks, and (3) are a super nerd that wants to look at espresso graphs every morning
I think you hit a key difference on workflow. Ā Flair demands your attention, Ā and back to back shots is doubly inefficient. Ā A semiautomatic like LM will be much more convenient and maybe thatās what OPs gf wants
My hot take: Short answer is no.
Even as a moderate discretionary expense, it did not represent great value for home use. It's very limited in capability (flat 9 bar, no pre-infusion without plumb-in, don't blather about pre-brew), but it does what it does extremely well. However, unless that is basically brewing a dozen shots back-to-back while steaming milk simultaneously on the regular, I don't see the value. So I installed it at the office, where 20-30 people abused it to the tune of 50+ shots per day and it was a champ. Easiest -- and the most heroically consistent -- with medium/dark italian style spro and milk drinks.
On the other hand -- anyone who says the price premium is for the brand/badging alone hasnt looked inside. It is an exquisite piece of intentional and at times clever engineering. From the quality of the fittings and valves to the self-cleaning gicleur and cold water mixing at the grouphead -- this thing will outlive you if it's maintained well. It's just a pity that it seems to lack even basic modern niceties (proper pump pre-infusion, shot timer)
There are other annoyances that soured me personally: the La Marzocco Home app and cloud integration is stupid stupid stupid. I mean just stupid. Why do I need the cloud to be able to schedule power on or set the fucking brew temperature? Don't bother, we all know the answer, and it is tragic that marketing dunces convinced someone at La Marzocco that IoTing appliances is a good idea.
To add further (perhaps controversial) perspective: I had the LMLM on my bench alongside a Slayer Single, Flair58, and Londinium Vectis. Best in cup (but worst workflow): Flair58 for all roast levels. Next was the Vectis (for medium and light roast coffees), followed very closely by the Slayer. LMLM trailed except for darker italian style ristrettos that explicitly preferred flat-9 extractions.
/end rant
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Fast heat-up, easy for beginners; inconsistent shots, annoying cleaning.
Gloomy_Inspector_385
