Fully Automatic Espresso Machine KF4 (KES8454BM)

I was sent one to test and it's quite lovely. Takes a lot of the guesswork out. Apparently this new line is more compact for counter space.

If it produces the same quality espresso with the same dose size as the KF6, KF7, and KF8 models, I think a lot of folks are going to jump on the less expensive models. If the grinder can adjust grind size automatically per drink without the need to run the grinder and waste a shot first, that is a pretty nice upgrade. Will need to wait and see if the machine can actually do this and what intelligrinder actually means. One unfortunate thing is there is no cold foam option. That really woule have added to any iced coffee style drink. Of course there is no swappable bean hopper. It was one of the reasons I went with the KF8 but ended up never actually using it. I think I might have swapped hoppers like three times since owning the machine. Having to waste a full dose of coffee when switching hoppers each time kind of made it not worth the effort.

- Smaller hopper - Smaller water tank - Smaller drip tray - Water tank in back - Probably plastic shell not metal - Smaller screen - Maybe more differences Sounds like it is generally worse, except maybe some newer technology (if this intelligrind can grind coarser for some drinks that would be nice) + smaller footprint + cheaper price.

Yeah, not putting down the KF4. Just saying it's not better than the KF8, and is likely worse (as expected!).

I'm not sure why. Both the KF4 and KF6 are losing functionality from the KF8. The main benefit of the KF4 appears to be the smaller footprint, but you lose the nice finishes of the 6/7/8. Except on insidepass, where you can currently get the KF4 for $585. Maybe that signals the price will be cheaper soon. It's just too bad you cant get a metal shell for a little more money. The small footprint is really nice.

Both my Philips and KitchenAid had explicit instructions in their manuals on what can only be described as a break in period. What would you like to call making and dumping 10 shots, followed by not adjusting the grinder for X period of time?

The KitchenAid in insiders pass.  Cheapest one is $800.   Other than that the Delonghi and Philips is about the same.   Delonghi usually clogs before you get the espresso to open.  The Philips might grind better than older models but it's a smaller 11g dose which means smaller cup but maybe better flavor. 

KitchenAid will make better milk then the jura e series.   The espresso is comparable to jura.  One isnt better than the other. Ka $800-1200

The KitchenAid machines on the insider pass deals is a no braner.  These machines don't appreciate with time. I wrote a long review on them a year ago.  It's 98% adjustable compared to jura being 100%. I think they killed it and 1200 or less a no brainer.  

Your Philips 5500 also has the flat ceramic burr, same as the 800 . A lot of Philips machines have the ceramic flat burr. They are not special and they are quite small. The kitchenaids are quite but the whole machine is insulated for sound. My jura has flat burr ceramic discs, they are not quiet and need a thick towel to muffel them. You want a ceramic flat disc for a certain flavor profile and they tend to stay cleaner. Grinds on a super auto are not that great anyway so I think it would be difficult for anyone to pickup the nuances between a flat disc or conical grinder. The Jura z10 has a conical grinder while the Giga 10 has flat discs for example. The quietness of it is Philips marketing team getting way over their skiis.

Delonghi is 12g and clogs easily.   Try a Miele, KitchenAid or jura if you are really looked for decent espresso from a super auto. 

People in this sub just group think and most people haven't tried more machines than the one they own. For instance, a lot of people trash the Bosch 800 but I know for a fact it makes espresso as good as a zura z10 as I've tried them both side by side and in fact a few of us thought the Bosch was better and is about $4k cheaper if you get it on sale. I've also tried the top end kitchenaid but not side by side and remembered thinking it's not any better. Point being, I'm not surprised on your analysis here.