ROCCAT (Turtle Beach) - Kone XP Air

I present to you the Turtle Beach/Kone XP Air I recently decided I needed a better mouse, specifically for Deadlock, and set out to replace my Razer Basilisk v3 (a great mouse in its own right). I wanted more buttons on the side to map items because I really try to keep my fingers on WASD at all times. I ordered a handful of mice, looking for mice with additional side buttons that were NOT mmo mice. I landed on the Steel Series Aerox 5, Glorious Model I 2, and the TB/Kone XP Air. I looked at the Corsair Nightsword, ROG Spatha and ROG Chakram X, but decided not to pull the trigger on them for various reasons. The Aerox 5 was an instant no. It has this weird whammy bar on the side that you flick up and down (like the guitar hero controller) that looked neat in theory, but it was really stiff and hard to use in practice. The Glorious Model I 2 was amazing and I almost kept it. The buttons are easy to reach with your thumb and it has multiple swappable buttons if you want different shapes. The m1 click action was very crisp and its also very light. I loved it. But then I got the XP Air. This mouse has some drawbacks. The M1 click action stinks, it's gummy with long travel distance and it feels bad. It's heavy at 100 grams. But the buttons, oh my lord the buttons. The side array is so perfect for items/skills with the quad button layout and the thumb rest button is literally the game breaker and why I bought it. **I mapped the thumb rest button to parry and I am able to parry/counterspell literally everything.** If you are looking for a better experience with using your active items, I strongly strongly recommend the XP Air. Deadlock isn't a twitch shooter, so the gummy M1 isn't as big a deal as it would be in COD or Battlefield (and I used it during both battlefield weekends and the side buttons were amazing there too). If you can't get over the gummy M1, and you think it's too heavy, then the Model I 2 is a really amazing runner up. My next plan is to mod the XP Air with a lighter battery and to remove some of the plastic guts with a Dremel. I've seen guides online where you can get it down to about 70 grams. That's all, thanks for coming to my TED talk.

Yeah basically a 602 but they don't make them anymore. Also, it has the tiltclick left and right on the scroll wheel and the thumb rest button which is honestly goated. Do you like the x15? I looked at it briefly but it had horrible reviews

I have a Naga Pro for WoW and a Roccat Kone XP Air for desktop usage... that thumb switch on the Roccat one is just so damn convenient for changing volume and stuff but for WoW the Naga is goated (the two other sideplates are just rotting in my drawer tho 😅)

Red dragon maybe? Their mmo mouse is actually amazing. I just stepped up to the kone xp air from there, but idk if that would be big enough. Maybe the g502 also.

If you want maximum longevity, you should stay away from Logitech, Razer, Steelseries, HyperX, Corsair, and Redragon, since their softwares are required to run their mice, and when they stop updating the drivers for your model it will stop working the next windows update. Additionally these brands also thin out the shells in highly stressed components in order to ensure they break after approximately 2 years of use. All these brands get money through a resale-scheme, by making you have to constantly buy a new product from them. My recommendations are from brands that are still small and growing (so they're economically incentivised to make good, reliable products and ensure they have good software support, even if they drop software support for later models, since people will most commonly look at their original products to gauge reliability). These brands are still gaining customer loyalty and as such will happily help you with any problems you face and have already designed their products to last as long as possible. If you wanna try vertical mice: The Hansker performance vertical mouse is shipped from Germany (if memory serves me correctly)and so should be relatively easy to post to India. The Keychron M5 is also worth a try since they have multiple European stores and warehouses. The swiftpoint Ergo-point is American unfortunately so I don't think you could source one easily. For standard ergonomic mice: Kysona Uranus Pro copies the tried and true Roccat Kone shape, it's cheap, built like a tank, and is amazing for palm grip. Keychron M7 (not the M6, the M6 has a design flaw in the sensor that makes it behave unexpectedly). Dareu A980. Glorious Model i 2 (the model i 1 has issues don't get it). Roccat/Turtle Beach kone XP air (discontinued, but there is still old stock floating around). These mice should all be fairly easy to source and relatively cheap (and most importantly, they're all built to last and their software isn't required to run to keep the mouse working, so you don't have to worry about software obsolescence thankfully, most actually can use browser-based software, meaning you open up safari or chrome or edge, open up the website, and then the website talks directly to the mouse and tells it what settings to change, no need to even download a software).

Dareu a980. _ 3 buttons. Glorious model i (the wireless one is better QC wise). _ 4 buttons. Keychron M7 (M6 has very weird sensor behaviour for unknown reasons, so don't get it, wait for reviews on the M5 first if you want the M6). _ 3 buttons. Swiftpoint Tracer (or Creator or Z2). _ 8 buttons + analog main buttons (Z2 has motion controls). (Discontinued, but old stock is still here and there) Roccat/Turtle Beach kone XP air. _ 7 buttons + scroll tilt. (If you're prepared for fighting Steelseries software, saving the keybinds to the on-board memory, disabling Steelseries software entirely, and then controlling the RGB with OpenRGB) the Steelseries Aerox 9 is mostly ok, not the best ergonomics though and easily the worst performance and weight of all of these. _ 12 buttons + scroll tilt.

I have tried the mmo mice with 12 buttons on the side and really don't like them. After years going through wow Legendary mice I went rival 500 then it got discontinued. I have finally found a good replacement which is the turtle beach Kone XP air. It is a good mouse and I hope they make one with higher grade of plastic. If you get one, get the white one, better quality.

Damn dude your hands are massive, maybe even bigger than mine. Ill give you the list of all of the mice I've tried. 1. Steel Series Aerox 5 - probably my favorite but it is expensive, I don't particularly like the software, It had an issue where it would disconnect randomly sometimes, and after a few years the scroll wheel stopped working. But the weight and button configuration are what are great about this one. It also has a comfortable shape for big hands. 2. Pulsar xlite v4 large - great mouse, great shape, i can almost palm it, I can if im feeling lazy, wide enough for a comfy finger tip grip that large hands pretty much have to use. I wish it had more side buttons but this is my current mouse that i replaced the Aerox with and I love it. I whole heartedly recommend giving this one a try. It has a simple software that just does what its supposed to and nothing else. The software also doesnt need to be running all the time. 3. Mionix Naos Pro - its almost perfect, its almost what i want it to be. if it were just a little taller i would be able to palm it. I think its a solid choice for xxl hands but its just not quite there, the pulsar is far lighter and has a better shape for fingertip grip. 4. Steel series rival - solid, heavy, you can actually add weights to make it heavier. back when i used this i didnt think i would like a light mouse. over all a good mouse with a good shape for large hands. 5. Logi G604 - great mouse, i dont think they make them anymore so they are hard to find/expensive. Scroll wheel is great. Probably about as close to an mx master as your gonna get. Has the weird shape where it gets skinnier where the ring and pinky finger rest so you end up dragging or sticking out your pinky. Lots of thumb buttons, did i mention i like that. 6. Roccat kone xp air - weird shape, almost looks like a left handed mouse but its not. i really like the button configuration but the shape just makes it uncomfortable for the ring and pinky finger, side buttons arent worth an uncomfortable grip 7. Logi G900 - meh one of the first "large" mice i aquired. Its too narrow to be comfortable for xxl hands. 8. Logi G502 - dont listen to anyone who recommends this mouse, its actually not really any smaller than any of the other mice here but the button placement is verry uncomfortable for xxl large hands. I think that about covers it other than I use an mxMaster 3 at work. I would still like for these all to be a little bigger but gaming mice don't get any bigger than this that i have found. TLDR I RECCOMEND THE PULSAR XLITE V4 LARGE Edit - I've held some of the razers at the store and i didn't particularly care for them.

I'm currently using Roccat kone XP air and its quite nice as an alterantive. I would really reccomend trying that over any other brand besides razer simply because - An mmo mouse is all about the software, if you cannot change those 12-whatever buttons layouts it just becomes painful. And the only softwares where you can easily do this without struggle is razer & roccat, all the other softwares have one issue or another....

White it indeed comes with a docking station, it has a major flaw. Battery time. I charge it at the minimum once per day, idk how long the battery lasts, but its less than 16hours at the very least. Chargest relatively quickly tho.

I personally find MMO-mice fine to click accurately. That said tho, the problem sounds more like your sitting position is super wrong or you go from "not gaming at all" to "gaming a lot suddenly". I've been playing mostly mmorpgs 16h+ per day for over 15 years without any issues/strains/pains. Eitherway if you are set on trying an MMO-mouse again, they are all kind of unique, so while G600 might not be to ur liking, the others might be. Since you alrdy have a G600 i'm not gonna say anything about it. Would advice staying away from Corsair scimitar - Corsair software is inferior to every other, it is also on the smaller side, but that might be a pro for some. Razer naga newest version is prolly among the better ones, but buttons are very easy to click and are in general smaller than the other mice, so it might be a bad fit to begin with if you are having a hard time navigating buttons. It has by far the best software tho. Roccat Kone XP Air - My curreny mouse, swapped from naga to this partly because i dropped my naga making the scrollwheel stop working. It is kind of a middle ground between an MMO mouse & a normal one, with only 4 side buttons (1 space button for your thumb which can also be used as an combination key) aswell as 2 extra buttons by your index finger, still giving you 7+ extra keys at your mouse. Software works decently, but nothing amazing. Corsair Ironclaw - is another one which has more buttons than usual but still not 12 button layout - played it for about 6months but the buttons feel kinda mushy & bad, combined with corsair software i can't reccomend.

I had this issue with both the old Scimitar and the Roccat Kone XP Air. I feal like it should be a basic thing for your mouse to still work as a mouse when all other bells and whistles of your driver break, but I guess that's too big an ask, lmao.

Maybe check out the Turtle Beach Kone XP Air or the Steelseries Aerox 5 although, some of its buttons are hard to reach and also weird material choice of slippery glossy buttons with a flick up and down button some people love it but I hate it. I ended up settling with the Kone I also use the naga but its heavy and wanted something a bit lighter.

Genuinely super impressed (coming from a loooooong line of Logitech mice) with a roccat kone xp (with their being an "air" version that's wireless). It looks/feels like slightly flattened Logitech g700s with 1 less "first finger button" the same double row of side buttons and a "shift" key under the thumb, sounds gimmicky, isn't. It's stuffed with RGB lighting but mines fine with it off too. With lights off it's a maaaany button office mouse.

You'll get a billion suggestions of G502. It's fine, it's a perfectly safe choice, logitech mouse. That out of the way: Roccat/Turtle beach Kone XP. If you ever loved the logitech G700(s), the Kone XP(air) is the spiritual successor. Was a mad, mad fanboy for the G700(s) had 2 regular and 1x "s". The kone XP is ABSOLUTELY the successor, not a single doubt in mind. Even the thumb shift key is placed right (just off most peoples thumb meat) and weighted perfectly IMO. RGB is meh, turn it off. In every other way, screw TB with a large rusty mace, sideways. Can't speak for any of their other trash. Roccat were all about AWESOME hardware with software coded by a 2 week old long haired gibbon on a "coffee only" diet. The Kone XP is the sweet spot, still well above average mouse hardware and software that works very well (after some updates, genuinely not had a single issue with it but I was late to the party).

Also try the g703. I have pretty large hands and this is the only mouse that fits just right. I've also enjoyed the kone xp air, but it's a bit smaller

I used to play with a Logitech G700s. But they haven't made that in a while. I found a similar mouse in the Roccat Kone XP Air. It has 5 thumb buttons and a couple extra ones on top.

I would recommend the Kone XP Air by roccat (or now by turtle beach since I think they bought roccat). I credit this mouse for changing the way I play wow. It has an excellent number of buttons for customization and largely fits everything I need in a mmo mouse. I also have small hands and it fits my grip perfectly.

https://a.co/d/aoYExBP This has been my favorite since I got it. Under the thumb is a button, 4 on the side, 2 on the top left, and one under the scroll wheel. Distributed well enough that it nothing gets missclicked

Turtle Beach kone XP Air Fewer side buttons buttons than the MMO mice but still great. i like it more than the g502 for shape. You might be able to find a Roccat version for less $$

Kone XP air is the best I've found for me. It's a very nice mouse, but the software is dogshit. I've got big hands, and the scimitar style 12 button mice are impossible for me to use.

Lol I actually liked the flipper/ up-down rocker thing. I found it easy to use. And yep I tried a roccat xp too. In fact I still have it sitting in a box in a drawer lol. I didn't use it for long. I think I just preferred the shape, weight and coating of the aerox. I'm sure it was a good option for some but I've never really vibed with roccat mice in general unfortunately.

I wish someone would clone the Roccat XP and make it lighter and ergo shape like the Naga.

The aerox 5 has that silly flipper instead of 2 additional side buttons (like the Roccat xp). Why not use the Roccat xp? Too heavy.

That’s true, in terms of mousepads, he’s good at recognising characteristics. And when it comes to mice, his personal experience with QC, button feel etc. Is actually very useful. What I don’t really like it that he doesn’t shift his lens when it comes to reviewing other mice that aren’t even aiming for the competitive FPS market, like the Kone XP. That mouse is very well built and great for productivity with some light gaming, but Boardzy slams it for being heavy and having a ton of buttons. I think he’s naive to assume that FPS gamers are the majority of the market (not even close).

+1. It's simply incredible, I love that mouse. Large, heavy, an absolute tank, and it's even wireless with a charging dock included. And the amount of buttons is perfect. Only downside though is that those side buttons feel unfathomable cheap for a 150$ mouse, and that's why I'm switching back and forth between that one and my Roccat Kone, those mechanical side buttons just feel so much better, even though the mouse is just flimsy in comparison.

I also had two Roccat Kones. First one lasted 1 year, second one lasted 1.5 years. Both ended up with double-click issues.

I love my mouse and it's not in there! Stay strong, Roccat Kone

I used a roccat kone for my mouse and I think its perfect. Its one of the very few gaming mice ive ever found that has 4 regular sized thumb buttons (most either just have 2 or a whole number pad with tiny buttons). Its only like 70$ and works very well.

Moderately large hands guy here who has dug through countless of these threads: You're right. Almost every mouse in this thread is too small for you. While eloshapes doesn't paint a complete picture of hand feel, you'll see that most recommendations is around the same size as the Deathadder V3, which is already too small for my hands. Gaming mice used to be way larger on average but nowadays the selection just sucks. The following mice are actually significantly larger, but many of them have other drawbacks like weight or shape or come with very dated tech because they're old. - Asus Rog Spatha X: largest "normal" gaming mouse I know of, but also heaviest - Asus Rog Chakram: smaller than Spatha, but still very large and heavy - Roccat Kone/Turtle Beach Kone - Intellimouse These two aren't longer than you average mouse, but somewhat wider instead. Doubt they're big enough for you but figured I should mention. - Mionix Naos Pro - Corsair Ironclaw

I also have quite big hands, although I don't have actual measurements. But the biggest mouse I ever had was the Roccat Kone. Updated versions are still around and eventhough I don't know how changed the design is compared to +/- 10 years ago, it might be worth investigating.

I loved my Roccat Kone (Aimo, Air, II, XP) mouses. They were great for bigger hands. Sadly Turtle Beach bought Roccat, and there are a lot of bad reviews now...not sure if the products are actually worse or just their bad reputation. But still the shape and size is spot on for me, you might want to test one if you can.

I've never used the magic mouse, even for things NOT gaming-related. I've always used a dedicated gaming mouse. I recently switched to the Logitech G502 Hero, as my old on (ROCCAT KONE) wasn't available anymore :(

The Roccat Kone is good, until it breaks. And it breaks soon. I know what I'm talking about, because I had three of them. Broken switches, broken cables, none of them survived more than two years.

I used to have a Roccat Kone and it was hughe, the Aimo seems to be the way to go

This one exactly. The roccat kone was my first mouse back when I got into college.

As another big handed gamer, you need to accept that heavy mice are okay. Roccat Kone is often recommended for bigger hands but you should consider fingertip grip if you need lighter. 

Exactly it is the one and only for me ! Such a great gaming mouse

First of all. Shape is king. Don't be worried about all the new optical tech and weight reduction. As someone who owns about 24 mice I've come to appreciate shape more than anything. There's no point in a weight class if your hand is gonna cramp in the first hour you're playing. At that point it doesn't matter what new tech is in the mouse or how feathery light it is. You're going to develop carpal tunnel down the line if you go at it like that. First, measure your hand and if you have the opportunity to test more in person like at an electronics store or if you have a friend that can let you borrow their mice with a different shape then your own go for it. I also highly encourage you watch different mouse reviews of different mice once you sort of come to that conclusion. The og Viper Ultimate is an excellent starting point to jump off of when exploring different mice. If I may, here are some things to consider/ look for when looking into other mice. - First of all, your Viper Ultimate is a bit of a flat mouse. The Viper Mini is wired but has a bit of a hump. This is highly subjective among gamers/ mouse enthusiasts because it affects how your palm is placed on the mouse itself. - Wired or not wired. Some prefer it wireless so there's no drag, but there are some mice that have very light braided cables or rubber cables. I personally use a Roccat Kone Pure Ultra that I switch off from my Ninjutso Sora. Please note that wired DOES add weight to the mouse, but depending on what kind of cable and if you use a mouse bungee or not will affect your gameplay. Having it wired never really bothered me. - Speaking of shape is king, there are mice that have different shapes and button layouts that you may find interesting. As I said before, The Roccat Kone Pure Ultra is one of my favorite mice in my collection. My first ever mouse was the older Roccat Owl Eye and I loved it for its shape. It has a bit of a curve that makes it more of a right hand mouse, but as a right handed person the curve actually suited my grip style. It also uses Titan mechanical switches that feel crisp to me. Is it faster than the switches in Razer's newer mice? Probably not, but I personally prefer the feel of the press over the latency test in game, which are marginal at best in my own personal testing. My other favorite mouse is the g502. Consider it's shape, multiple button options and the infinite scroll wheel where you can toggle a switch to have the scroll wheel spin instead of click in steps. It's heavier even without weights, but it's a comfortable mouse that also doubles as a nice productivity mouse for work. I would look into if having more buttons for your gaming/ productivity for work would be beneficial for your setup. - Don't worry about things like 8k polling rates or the newer switches that gets put into the newer mice. Unless you have an extremely beefy PC and a crazy monitor you won't really see those returns. Even if you had those in your setup, your performance still comes down to how comfortable you are to land your shots. Remember, even back then during the early days of Twitch and competitive online gaming that made certain streamers rich and famous, even they started off using wired mice. Ninja used a Logitech G502 and even used his own Finalmouse Ninja collab for years before going wireless. It just goes to show that practicing with the mouse that feels the most comfortable is what works. I hope this helps!