ZA13-C

Try a Waizowl Cloud on Aliexpress.. Sellers are selling them for $40 I own ZA12-C, ZA13-C, S1-C, S2-C and OP18K additionally a Intellimouse Pro.. - which gave me inspiration to checkout the Waizowl Cloud The ZA12-C grip width is perfect for me - other mice are just a little to narrow like you described. The Waizowl Cloud is super comfortable and I aim well with it. Checkout on eloshapes! - [https://www.eloshapes.com/mouse/compare?p=scyrox-v8-vs.-zowie-za13-c-vs.-zowie-za12-c-vs.-microsoft-pro-intellimouse-vs.-waizowl-ogm-cloud](https://www.eloshapes.com/mouse/compare?p=scyrox-v8-vs.-zowie-za13-c-vs.-zowie-za12-c-vs.-microsoft-pro-intellimouse-vs.-waizowl-ogm-cloud) For aggressive / comfortable claw the ZA12-C is still my fav.. perfect grip width and super comfortable round rear hump. The Waizowl Cloud is another fav shape easily with as much research as I've done comparing back and forth.. The tech and weight for the $ is also pretty great - idc for 4/8k hz mice.

GPX. I am by no means a mouse collector but out of all the mice I have tried, I feel I play the best on it. In fact, I no longer care about mice now that I have a GPX tbh. My 2nd place would be the ZA13-C, but after getting the GPX I found that the huge hump on the ZA13-C was less comfortable. Also, the really low button height on the ZA13-C left me much less room for my fingers on the side of the mouse, as I like to extend them towards the front of the mouse. The weight and the freedom of wireless also helps a whole lot.

Razer cobra wired Zowie c series (ec3-c, za13-c, s2-c, fk2-c) these are all small mice of zowie and they're all high quality plus it uses an optical scroll wheel like the g502 hero

Depends EC for ergonomic, fk for claw/fingertip, s/za/u for claw grip

XM2 8k Zowie c series (EC, s, fk, za)

Check out mice with optical scroll wheel encoders it's usually has better longevity than mechanical encoders. Mice with optical scroll wheel - zowie c series, g502x/basilisk v3, leviathan v4, keychron m6.

I can list good wired mice - op18k v2/XM2 8k v2, dav3 wired, pulsefire haste 2 wired, pulsefire saga wired, redragon m996 wired, zowie c series.

G502x, basilisk v3, zowie c series (EC, s, fk, za)

Check out the steelseries prime / prime mini wired the mini is lighter tho Zowie c series mice - they're on 70+ weight but zowie discontinued it so chances are you're going to buy a second hand unit

Great choice! I never used the FK2 but I do own the U2 and ZA-13 and am a fan of Zowie mice. I’ve had my eye on the S2 for awhile now. At some point you may want to consider this program. I did it years ago when I was new to gaming mice and it really helped me understand what shapes I did and did not like. https://zowie.benq.com/en-us/mouse/dw-mouse-fitting-kit.html

I’ll always recommend anything from MCHOSE and ATK. RAWM also has some good shapes but their prices jump dramatically depending on the product. I’ve used MCHOSE’s L7+ Ultra (Sora V2) , M7 Ultra (Zowie U2), A7 Pro (GPX Superlight), K7 Ultra (Razer Viper V3), and the Ace 60 Pro keyboard (Wooting 60HE). I generally liked all of the products but many simply weren’t for me because of various issues I had with specific shapes. The actual mouse quality was great and they were reasonably priced. Skates were hit or miss with some mice having great skates and others not. I still have the A7 Pro and the Ace 60 Pro to this day. ATK has changed quite a bit since I last used their products. The quality has improved significantly. Unfortunately I can’t say much more than that about them as I haven’t used their newer models but I keep up with their releases and I would recommend them as a good starting point for affordable mice. RAWM is a bit newer and they offer some new and unique shapes that I’d not seen before. I’ve been able to use the MH01 which is this interesting hybrid of the Razer Viper V2 and Razer Viper V3. What does that look like? It’s got the body of the V3 with the grip area of a V2, so like really aggressive curves that tell you where to grip from. I thought was cool but I found it caused finger pain after an hour or two. I kept trying to make it work and would even swap mice to see if it was just me but unfortunately I couldn’t bear using it for long enough. Lastly I’d like to recommend some “premium” brands that are still cheaper compared to Razer or Logitech. Lamzu and Pulsar are both brands that have a good variety of shapes at varying prices *depending on where you buy them*. You can find both within range of $90-$130 or less if you buy used. Of Lamzu’s product line I’ve used the Maya X, the Atlantis OG V2, the Inca ( Zowie Za13), and the Thorn. I found the Atlantis to be a bit too aggressive for me as it really locks in your grip so I gave it to a friend. The Thorn is a good shape for relaxed claw but you can claw it normally if you’ve got a tilted grip. I loved the Inca initially because it almost feels like a pen in your hand, it’s surprisingly narrow and really fills out the palm in a way I’ve not experienced with anything else. Unfortunately I’ve not used it much since I got it, after about a week of consistent use I was experiencing hand cramping. Turns out it was too small for me and I was basically pinching the sides with the force of a thousand suns just to stay stable. Lastly the Maya X, the bigger brother to the original Maya. I still use this one today as it’s my main mouse. It’s like if the GPX actually leaned into claw grip rather than trying to work for every grip. I don’t really know how else to describe it but I like it. Pulsar is probably the one I’ve got the least amount of time with compared to other brands. I found that many of their shapes just didn’t work for me for some reason or another. Of their products I’ve used the X2V2, X3, X2H, Xlite V3 and the TenZ Signature Edition. The X2 version 2 was my least favorite, hump support was pushed too far to the rear in my opinion and the actual grip area was like a brick. Its sides while slightly angled are very flat so it does allow for some variation in finger placement but you’re not doing much else but clawing. This actually fine as that’s what the mouse is designed for but I personally found it an uncomfortable shape to claw. I used to call it the poor man’s XM2 but both are pretty cheap nowadays so it’s just preference. The X3 I was initially excited for as I was looking for a lightweight clone of my G703. I would be disappointed to find that it was wider and stubbier by comparison. It’s just not the same and I wouldn’t find the clone I was looking for until just last year with the Teevolution Terra Pro which is a ~40g 1:1 clone with better skates and a better coating. The X2H was everything I already didn’t like about the X2 but with a higher hump and a steeper click. You might wondering why I bothered purchasing it at all if I didn’t like the X2. It was mostly because I figured the issue was I wasn’t getting enough palm contact. Turns out I just find it uncomfortable and the additional height didn’t help. I was then that realized I should be looking for mid to center rear humps with a more narrow grip area. The Xlite V3 was really just a purchase made because I was curious. The only ergo mice I’d used at that point were the Lamzu Thorn, Logitech G703, Vaxee E1, and Vaxee Outset AX. I would later learn that the Xlite was meant to be a clone of the Zowie EC series. It was an odd ergo to get used to and I never really stuck with it because I couldn’t get as good a grip as I could on my G703 or my Outset AX. The only other ergo I’ve used since was the Razer Deathadder V3 Pro which I got on sale for much cheaper than what it was sold it for at the time. The TenZ Signature Edition was my most recent purchase from Pulsar though I’ve not bought much of anything from them for quite a while. This was more of what I wanted out of the X2H. Hump has been pushed forward a little and lowered. The front has been brought up a bit so it’s not nearly as steep. And it’s got a more narrow grip area. While I did like it more than anything else I’ve used from Pulsar it still wasn’t what I was looking for. I am curious to try their most recent release of the X2N which seems like it’s exactly what I’ve been looking for from them for the last several years but I don’t have the money for it at the moment so it’ll just have to wait. I hope my long winded reply helps you find what you’re looking for.

Any XM1 variant they're all the same, ZA13, which I use now and is my main, I aggressive knuckle claw with about the same hand size and I have very much enjoyed using both mice, anything with a rear hump and thin grip width has been very preferable for me.

Thank you, your comments are very valuable. I think i will make my decision in 2days but I decided i will try Zowie za13/Lamzu Inca(clone of za13) because big hump would release the tension from my hand rather than looking for wider/narrower mouse. Back palm support also would make my aim more consisent. 1. Zowie ZA13/Lamzu Inca 2. Zowie U2 3. Back to Zowie fk2 because i miss the feeling I can send back mouse in 14days so i will try because za13 could help me a lot with my tension in hand.

Okey. I decided before I make an order. I will go to the shop and check for deathadder. I want to be sure that I’m done with ergo for good.  But I decided that first order will be endgame xm2 4K because it’s slightly bigger than s2 and same shape. It will fill my palm more which is what I need exactly. I experimented with grip and looks I can hold relaxed claw touching palm to my wrist but I need something slightly bigger than zowie s2 . Zowie za13 feels smaller than s2 which I can’t handle.