EpiqVision Ultra LS800 Ultra Short-Throw Laser Projector

It's not worth it for an 80" screen size IMO. The main benefit of having a projector is a huge screen to go with it because the contrast will be worse than a TV. That said, if you just want a clean look and don't want a giant black panel hanging in the room, USTs are a good option. Maybe consider a cheaper Hisense model? One big advantage of the Epson, however, is that you can place it much closer to the wall than other models.

I finally got my UST setup to a point where it feels less like a project and more like something I can actually just use. I went with an Epson LS800, mostly because I wanted a big screen without dealing with a ceiling mount, long cable runs, or having a projector sitting behind the couch. I know UST setups get a lot of mixed opinions, but for a regular living room, I can see why people go this route. The biggest surprise for me has been how normal it feels once everything is dialed in. The projector is right under the screen, nobody walks through the beam, and I don’t have to think about throw distance across the room. It just makes the room feel cleaner. The screen matters way more than I expected too. I knew a projector would look better at night, but I was honestly surprised by how watchable it still is during the day. It is not the same as a blacked out theater room, obviously, but for casual watching in a living room, it is better than I thought it would be. The annoying part is that UST placement is still very precise. Tiny changes in height or distance show up immediately. Getting the image lined up took more patience than I expected, especially because it looks “almost right” before you notice one edge is slightly off. The console ended up being more important than I thought for that reason. I originally just cared about having something clean under the screen, but having the projector sit in a more intentional spot makes the whole setup feel a lot less hacked together. Friends always notice the big screen first, then they start asking how the cabinet setup actually works. Overall, I get the appeal now. It is not the cheapest or simplest way to do projection, but for a living room where you want a huge image without turning the whole space into a dedicated theater, UST makes a lot of sense. Anyone else here using a UST in a normal living room instead of a dedicated theater room? How picky was your alignment process? **Update:** I saw a lot of people asking what projector, screen, and console I’m using, so I figured I’d just answer it here instead of replying individually. The screen I went with is a Vividstorm 120" motorized floor-rising UST ALR screen. The projector console/cabinet is the Cinest UST projector media console. The brand actually sent me a pre-release sample to try out, so it hasn’t officially launched yet. I’ve been using it for a couple of weeks now and have really liked it so far. Super clean design, and the adjustable platform works perfectly for dialing in projector placement!

Lumens do help, the likes of nexigo ap mk2 is dimmer than others which causes it to dimmer even with higher gain screen. Say 1000 lumens with 2.0 gain is still dimmer than 2000 lumens with 2.0 gain. Lower gain will help with black level on all the projectors though. So if ls800 is paired with 0.6 gain to have good black, then nexigo will have even better black with that screen as it's dimmer. "Iirc nexigo is not very bright" Imo it's quite simple, OP just needs to choose either to use it for day use with higher gain screen and elevated black or night use with lower gain screen that has better black. Sure most will prefer lower gain to get better black, but some do prefer to use their projector with ambient light.

i have one too and love it!

As an Epson owner I'm potentially biased, but the LTV 3500 is very bright and has absolute ass black level. For bright material it can look good but in dark scenes it's absolutely terrible and also quite expensive. The Epson isn't the greatest at black level but it's pretty decent on 70% power and with dynamic contrast on, it depends on the viewer and what they expect. If rainbow effect isn't a bugaboo for you personally, there's the Nexigo Aurora Pro MKII and the Hisense PX3-Pro which both beat the Epson and AWOL easily, though Epson has some specific advantages - first, the shortest throw on the market so easier to place, and it's 3LCD so it has zero rainbow effect. These reasons would have to matter considerably to make the Epson the one to go with (in my case, both were relevant and I'm quite happy with my Epson.) Literally any UST 99.9% needs a proper ALR screen. It helps a ton in the daytime obviously but crucially it also improves image quality and contrast a shit ton in the dark. It's an expense any UST buyer should factor in. For these, you want low gain (like 0.5, 0.6) because this helps improve the percieved black level. The units have plenty of firepower to lose some due to a low gain. [ALR Screen VS White WALL - Side by Side Comparison in Different Lighting Conditions | Chris Maher, YouTube](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XG1rVFTnkuE) As for HDR, Dolby Vision and all that stuff, it's obviously an advantage to have support for those, but no projector can actually do HDR. They can only adapt the HDR material to the best their light output can do. High Dynamic Range means a wide difference between black level and peak light. But projectors can't project blackness, so if you add a ton of lumens you will still not get the extreme contrast numbers you want for real HDR because your black level won't be black. So these things all slot into the "nice to have" category way more so than "must have". New units have support for it; the Epson sadly doesn't but since I feed my Epson off a HTPC with MPV anyway it's not that important, I'm still squeezing everything the projector can do out of it.

My Epson LS800 was pretty unbearable at 100% light output. Fortunately, at 70% pretty exactly the fan noise drops dramatically and stops being a factor at all for me. Since dialing down the lasers also helps the 3LCD panels block light to show black, and I have a 0.5 gain screen which further drops the black, I get what I'd consdier a very good image with low fan noise.

You'd be hard pressed to find a top grade projector where 4K isn't just thrown in as part of the deal. But let's just say I'm not at all upset that my Epson LS800 "only" has doubled up 1080p. The limitations of the human eye means it still looks glorious - fron the seated position. Sure, you can see a difference up close and all but still. But either way... if you buy a good projector today it's 4K so the discussion is academic. 8K however would be total horseshit in just about every way... However, if you showed me two projectors, otherwise identical seeming, one 1080 and the other 4K, and then told me the 1080 model had more light output, better native contrast and lower black level, but they cost the same, I'd pick the 1080 without any hesitation.

The LS800 is the best of them and at about 70% brightness the fans become almost inaudible. At 100% power you get a little more light output but there's also noise. Epsons tend to have audible fans. However, that presupposes the right screen and the right placement. The thing that makes UST's more resilient to daylight (not immune, just somewhat more resilient) is the UST specific ALR screen, and the fact that the UST is placed on a bench in front of the screen. If you ceiling mount, you lose that entirely and have to use a white screen, and at that point you're probably better off with a long throw. At least that will bounce the light more or less towards you instead of into the floor. UST's are zero compromise when it comes to placement. They *have to* be at the right distance both horizontally and vertically from the screen; the LS800 is the shortest throw on the market so it doesn't have to come quite as far away as others. Projectorcentral.com has throw calculators. You could do something like a Valerion Visionmaster Pro 2 and Valerion's Fresnel ALR screen for those. The ALR is a little less effective than an UST ALR (because an UST fires from such a unique angle from below, it's easier to reject light from above) but if you need it ceiling mounted that would be one of the few sensible approaches I can think of. Here's a rando video that shows what a Valerion with ALR would look like https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TfOfofvQzis - a big difference in the dark, and an enormous difference with lights. Darkness is still basically a requirement to use a projector. Your image looks absolutely terrible compared to what my ALR creates with some light but there's no projector that can ignore ambient light.

I literally just used the Android interface long enough to set up the screen settings and dial in the modes as best as one can (one inexplicable and cursed thing Epson did with these was to remove almost all calibration controls, which is somewhat infuriating since I have calibration hardware... but they can be made pretty good with what you have to work with.) Once I had dialed in the image settings, I hit the game mode button on the remote and switched to HDMI3 which bypasses all that Android stuff and I use my LS800 purely as a screen, no audio, no "smart" apps, that's all on the other side of the AV receiver. I remote control it with a combo of Home Assistant and a Broadlink RM4 Pro, and a plain old universal remote; I had to teach my old Harmony 650 the Epson IR codes but once done I can operate my entire system with one remote. I don't like the unpredictability and weirdness that CDC can introduce, rather discretely control everything.

It's absolutely worth it. An UST and a lightweight screen are logistically an absolute breeze vs an absolutely enormous TV. The TV fans argue that TV's work better in the light and have deeper blacks, and both are true. They never seem to agree though that a good UST with an ALR screen still has an excellent and extremely enjoyable image. It's just that 120 is better since more size is more immersion but that doesn't mean a more space limited set up with 100 inches won't be immersive and a great deal of fun. Go watch this, his videos and comparos are always top notch and make up your own mind https://www.thesmarthomehookup.com/big-screen-battle-100-qled-tv-vs-projector-vs-ust/ I *literally* carried in my fairly large Epson LS800 UST by myself, and I also dragged in the screen myself, assembled it on my living room carpet and I even hung it on the wall solo (though that part was borderline stupid, should have been less impatient and had a friend over, a 120 inch screen isn't too heavy to handle solo but it's pretty cumbersome, there's a risk of bending the frame). A 100 inch TV? I'd have needed two beefy workmen to haul it in and I'd have had to literally reconstruct and strengthen my old wall to hold it most likely, they really cut corners on that construction... obviously no problem hanging a light screen, it's even anchored in the drywall with Geefix drywall anchors. You *do* need to control the light in the room with any projector. Even an UST with the 99.9% required ALR screen. The ambient light rejecting screens cost real money but they help both with rejecting any remaining ambient light, and they help by aiming the light from the screen at you, instead of at the ceiling and walls.

UST's can absolutely be a ball ache to set up. Certainly you have to do a lot of math and measuring and figuring things out. The center channel placement is a big one. For casual use, it's not so bad, if you just want to use the projector's speaker. Still tinkering but not too bad. I'd have to flat out disagree on point 5, though. It varies from projector to projector but modern triple laser UST's with an Iris etc will be able to compete with most sub-$10 grand long throws, and in a living room will always be superior thanks to the UST specific ALR. In a dedicated room you probably want a long throw, if only to get a proper anamorphic 2.35:1 thing going, but even there if you need no more than 150 inches an UST would be quite viable. The ALR screens don't just help in the light, they help a lot in the dark. They aim the light at the viewer, cause way way less spill light on the walls and ceiling, and deflect away what little spill light still lands on it. I'd love a high end JVC with an anamorphic lens and a 180 inch 2.35:1 SI Black Diamond long throw ALR in a dedicated space. I just don't have that room, or that budget.

The LS800 is extra finicky because it has by far the shortest throw on the market. This means that every move of it is extra amplified due to the acute angle the image is projected at. All UST's are finicky but this is the worst. But, worth it, for the ease of placement. I wouldn't necessarily recommend an LS800 even though I love mine, but that's mostly because the most recent crop of triple laser DLP's are just better when it comes to image quality. In some cases, dramatically better. But dramatically better than pretty damn spectacular is not perhaps the biggest deal, since you're already at pretty spectacular. I use a 120 inch Epson screen with 0.6 gain which is perfect, helps a lot with perceived black level. Make sure to try lowering the laser power to 70% precisely, with the remote and the brightness control on that. As soon as you hit 70%, the fan shuts up.

Lumens aren't really what makes an UST work in a lit room, it's 100% the screen. And I would personally never buy a screen with over 1 in gain for an UST but that's just me. My LS800 (which is bright but no longer freakishly so compared to the recent crops of UST's) is on a 0.6 grain screen and it works well with some ambient light in the room, and the 0.6 gain brings black levels down a lot especially once I run the unit at 70% laser power. Black levels matter. OP can just draw the curtains and not live with a shimmery gray black level, in my opinion. I have never gone "Damn, wish this was a little brighter and had more gain" on my setup, but I have gone "hmm, black levels are really pretty decent but it could be better" even with a 0.6 gain. With 1+ gain it would suck; I strongly suspect the reason The Hook Up's tests of the LS800 made it look really bad on black level compared to the Chinese units he tested as well was that he used a higher gain fresnel screen. A lower gain lamellar helps this unit out.

Projectors aren't movie specific. The Aetherion Max is a great unit, but now that it's out of kickstarter the price-performance calculation got a lot more complicated. For $2-something grand, a no brainer buy. For $5 grand, it gets a lot less clear cut, in my mind. Also, since you say you don't want to watch in the dark (although, frankly, for movies you absolutely should black out the room because UST's suffer from daylight as well, they just suffer less because of UST specific ALR screens) you need a good ALR screen. The screen is what makes USTs perform passably in a lit room and that's a very important part you need to factor in. The screen alone can run you $2 grand. In the cheapo end there's stuff like Nothing projector, and then it's up from there; Spectra Vision recently released a screen that combats triple-laser induced laser speckle quite well by all accounts and that might be worth looking at, and that's gonna be $2+ grand in a 120 inch I suspect. The Nexigo Aurora Pro MK II and the PX3 Pro are still two frontrunners, but there are as was noted a MK III and PX4 Pro basically coming out any time now, possibly in Q3 or something (no real clue, but they've been shown in public already so can't be far). There might be some Kickstarter opportunity there to get one for cheaper.

I have an Epson UST and absolutely no regrets. I'm just about to put some motors on my blackout curtains so I can just push a button to black out the room, which is necessary in the summer. Now in the wintertime it's black out when I get home so no worries over the winter. Anyway, the ever reliable Hook Up channel has some input on this also: [Big Screen Battle! 100" QLED TV vs Projector vs UST | The Hook Up, YouTube](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vPikt0UbhPk)