Pipedream 400

Personally, if this is something you plan to do more then I'd upgrade my sleeping bag. The Alpkit Pipedream 400 or 600 are reasonably priced for the specs and warmth. If you want a quilt then look at the Otimos UL 850 or the Neve Waratah quilts. Budget friendly but highly rated.

That's funny. I'm also 35, based in London and also a relative beginner at wild camping (although been camping all my life) but have ammassed a small collection of decent gear without bankrupting myself or having to buy twice. I've now done a bunch of wild camps including dartmoor. Have done two winter wild camps elsewhere (first was -4C, second was a couple of days ago at -1 or -2C ish overnight). Despite limited experience, I have some suggestions which I will list below in case it helps, to each their own but take from it what you will. 1) Travel as light as humanly possible - it makes a HUGE difference. The first time was frankly a bit miserable as I tried to pack for every eventuality and it's just not necessary and I was in agony from carrying the weight, also most of my gear was super cheap and heavy (regular camping equipment). Question every single item you bring. 2) If possible, get a down sleeping bag whether new or second hand. I recently bought an alpkit pipedream 400 on sale which is less than half the size and weight of my old cheap synthetic sleeping bag and about 10 times warmer. With the rest of my system, I was almost too warm at -2C. 3) Don't underestimate how important a high R sleeping mat is in cold weather, it can mean the difference between toasty night or a cold miserable night. Personally, I'd recommend a single high R inflatable mat like an alpkit radiant (£87.99 but R7.2 and only 640g), or cheaper similar alternative. 4) You can pair a bivy bag with the sleeping bag for a good few degrees more warmth when going to bed, but be warned that you will feel colder in the morning as it will trap all the moisture from your body inside the sleeping bag / bivy combo. 5) I have a Lanshan 2. Around 1kg plus hiking poles that I carry anyway, plenty sturdy, affordable, spacious. Just pick your spot carefully - try not to pitch at the top of a hill in gale force winds without any kind of natural shelter. I also opted for the 4 season variant as it's a bit less drafty and warmer, I'd feel a bit exposed with so much mosquito mesh on the inner on the 3 season but that's me. Trekking pole tents can be sturdier than other options. Your pitch makes a huge difference to how exposed to the elements your tent, can feel 5 degrees warmer sheltered from the wind. 6) Trekking poles came in EXTREMELY handy on Dartmoor to feel out the path and avoid sinking into bog especially if going off the beaten track. I wouldn't go back without them. 7) I was dubious, but having recently bought and used a merino wool base layer (both top and bottoms), it made such a huge difference to my comfort that I was genuinely astounded and I didn't feel damp or cold after exertion. These can also essentially serve as a replacement for a sleeping bag liner providing a similar level of insulation for your body and protecting your sleeping bag from sweat and body oils. They also don't smell after being worn constantly for several days. I'd say forget the liner and do this. 8) Can't speak for bag as I have a comfortable but big 55l Berghaus rucksack that I found cheap, looking to get a lightweight option. 9) Bring minimal clothes, IMO just accept being grimy for a couple of days and only bring a change of clothes for absolutely necessary items (e.g. socks in case the ones you are wearing get wet). Merino layers and such make this much more acceptable as they don't smell. Test in advance what you can get away with in colder weather - both times now I brought multiple extra warm layers, didn't end up needing them and had to carry the weight for no reason. I absolutely swear by my Trespass down jacket - incredible warmth in a ridiculously small and light package, but if using down, always bring self adhesive patches as I have ripped holes on brambles, barbed wire, melted a hole brushing on a hot stove etc. 10) I swear by my super cheap little fire maple heat exchanger pot (kinda like a jetboil alternative) with an alcohol stove. Currently using a trangia but there are lighter alternatives. Also sometimes use this with a titanium firebox nano which a trangia perfectly slots into, or can also be fuelled by sticks fed in from the side. Also don't over or under pack food, bring calorie dense snacks and lightweight things that can be rehydrated. I'm a huge fan of making a batch of chilli con carne (or veg if you prefer) and rice then dehydrating it in the oven on low spread thin on a sheet of greaseproof paper, light weight hearty and delicious, just add hot water and let it soak / cook for a few mins. Carry just enough water and aim to stop or camp by a river, water purification tables are effective, tiny and super super lightweight.

I just took this for scale, those are a 500ml and a 1 lite bottle beside it: https://preview.redd.it/io1n3o7zfbcg1.jpeg?width=4080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=25264a8578954f21eca85cf140025651c76a01a4 I don't know if this particular bag will be available where you are, it is an Alpkit pipedream 400. There will be a ton of manufacturers which will sell bags at least as good as this if not better. But yeah if you want packability then a down bag is the way to go.

I'm not so sure they are that far off. I slept in my pipedream 400 (long) and a silk sleeping bag liner down to about -0.5 and I was toasty all night. It felt like I could have squeezed at least another one or two degrees out of it and I really don't think my silk sleeping bag liner adds much warmth at all.

My sleeping bag weighs 783g. The small stuff sack weighs 25g. The specs say they should weigh 910g and 30g. So I'm 127g under the spec weight on my sleeping bag. The comfort limit is rated at 4.2°c and Alpkit say that the long version might lose up to 2°c of that warmth. Therefore I would hope that my bag would be comfortable down to -2.2°c. As I've said before, I have comfortably slept in temperatures of something between -1 and 0°c using a silk sleeping bag liner and it felt like it had at least one or two degrees more to give. I can't answer for the discrepancy between the spec weight and real world weights but it does loft very well.

The Pipedream does me fine for now. I try not to go below zero in it anyway. But when I do eventually come to replace it I will take into consideration yours and other people's concerns that I have seen online.

You say that the Met Office doesn't have it below zero but is the location that you are checking on their app or website at exactly the same altitude that you plan to be camping in? If you're not sure then might I suggest something along the lines of... Windy.com or Meteoblue or alpineconditions.com All of which would allow you to get a location specific forecast (Met Office data is available on the windy.com and alpine conditions.com services as well as other services). Also, be wary of the wind and rain coming in on Sunday, the wind gusts and total daily rainfall look a bit gnarly.

Yeh they seem to be good. I've got the 800 and it's fantastic, been on multiple below zero camps with it and been toasty warm. Obviously heavier than my alpkit pipedream 400 but that thing is nowhere near as warm as it's made out to be, can really tell the difference in quality. Think the pipedream 400 is a comfort level of -4 if I remember rightly but I've been cold in it at zero

The pipe dreams coming out of alpkit are underweight so they are around 30% off in their temp rating. Maybe pair it with an inner

If you could weigh it? I sent mine back as it was way off - this was the 400 too. Just had a relook and this was my experience: PipeDream 400 - Mine comes in at 830g including the stuff sack, whereas Alpkit lists: - Sleeping bag: 865g - Stuff sack: 30g - Total: 895g So that’s about 65g lighter than expected. Given that shell fabrics, zip, etc. don’t usually vary much, that difference is likely coming from the down fill: - Stated fill: 400g - Estimated actual: ~335–350g That’s roughly 50–65g under spec, which seems well outside normal tolerance. From what I understand, that kind of shortfall could translate to something like 2–4°C less warmth. I have seen others with the same issue but it would be good to know if it was more common