Women's Cosmic Down 20

https://preview.redd.it/oltkwae5vecg1.jpeg?width=3000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0e17de6ee5683127b571669be178e871faed37d2 Left: Kelty Tuck 20, synthetic. Right: Kelty Cosmic Down 20. Comfort ratings are 20⁰F and 25⁰F, respectively. Both are women's bags, which means more fill & bulk. The down bag is 550 FP & packs down to \~11 liters. I just looked up your bag & it looks like it packs down to \~21 liters, so it probably does seem enormous in its regular stuff sack. I'm so sorry!

Some tent options https://www.kaviso.com/collections/tents-shelters/products/sierra-designs-full-moon-2p-3p-tent https://www.campsaver.com/kelty-late-start-2p-tent.html https://www.naturehike.com/products/mongar-2-person-ultralight-backpacking-tent Sleeping bag: You're not going to find a sleeping bag that keeps you warm at 20°, packs up to a reasonable size, and costs less than $75. Your best bet is to hope for a deal on marketplace or get a down camp blanket and use it with your current sleeping bag. Sleeping pad: https://www.backcountry.com/therm-a-rest-prolite-plus-sleeping-pad-womens https://www.als.com/sea-to-summit-camp-self-inflating-sleeping-pad-10350624/p https://www.walmart.com/ip/Featherstone-El-Cordion-Insulated-Closed-Cell-Foam-Sleeping-Pad-for-Camping/167563817

Do you actually need a bag that keeps you warm at 20F or are you just looking for a 20F bag? for context most bags are named for their limit rating, where you'll start to feel pretty cold. So for example a Kelty Cosmic Down 20F will keep you warm down to about 32F, that temperature is the comfort rating. The reason I ask is that bags really start to ramp up in price when the comfort ratings get below 32F. 20F limit rating bags (bags that will keep you warm to 32F) are common, 5-10F limit rating bags (what you'd need to be warm at 20F) are not as common

No problem at all. My personal favorite cold weather sleeping bag is the Sierra Designs Mobile Mummy 15, which I've used into the low 20s but I don't think they sell it anymore. You could go two ways with it, you could get one bag that would keep you warm by itself down to 20F, or you could get a sleeping bag and a camp blanket. The sleeping bag would keep you warm down to freezing, then when you add the blanket on top it would give you another 5-10 degrees of warmth. That would also add more flexibility for temp ranges. If you want to go the first route this is the best bang for buck I could find, the upsides are that it's down which means it will pack much smaller than any comparable synthetic insulated bag and is lighter than a 2-bag system. the downsides are that it will probably be too hot for warmer weather camping and since it doesn't have a hood you'll have to wear something on your head to keep it warm at night: https://www.kaviso.com/collections/sleeping-bags/products/kelty-supernova-0-degree-sleeping-bag?variant=45681345462500 If you want to go the second route here are the good bang for buck sleeping bags I found: https://www.rei.com/product/C00655/mountain-hardwear-lamina-eco-af-15f-9c-sleeping-bag https://www.rei.com/product/250709/marmot-sawtooth-sleeping-bag-mens https://www.pariaoutdoorproducts.com/collections/affordable-backpacking-gear-sleeping-bags-pads/products/thermodown-15-backpacking-sleeping-bag?variant=11778285191 The first is synthetic, the second two are down. If you get one of those add a cheap camping blanket from Amazon. Here are some examples, the first one I have and was pleasantly surprised by the quality, the second one I know nothing about but I like the foot drawcord, and the third is one I've heard someone else say they like: https://a.co/d/0bSS6yGR https://a.co/d/0bxxSp2f https://a.co/d/01kbAOW2 It goes without saying that you should do your own research into any of these bags before pulling the trigger, I've only done a cursory review of each.

Kelty Cosmic Down 20F is a great “budget” bag that has yet to let me down in the cold. It’s almost too warm.

Can't speak for paria but I wouldn't be super skeptical. I have some old campmor 0F 650F bags that aren't super light but at 3.5lbs they are warm and over 30 years old. I stored and cared for them but they definitely saw some use. I've also got a Kelty Cosmic 20F, probably from pre-2010. Loft on it is still amazing. It's been washed a few times (I got it because it's cheap and I backpack with my dog). It's far exceeded expectations in warmth and durability. As long as I'm on a good pad it's warm till close to 20F. Good enough got me. If I add down socks and down or fleece pants it's good to 15F and I've used it down to 10F with a vapor barrier and bivy. It's not that compact or light (2lbs and change) but somewhat bulky. Anyway, I paid, maybe $400 for 3 bags, and they keep me warm. Sounds like paria is similar value/quality. It will make a good loaner or beater bag if you upgrade to a 1000F western mountaineering down the line.

Yeah, that does make a difference. I'm using that cosmic with down pants and socks for overnights (2 nights tops) down to -10C or about 15F....on a R7.5 pad on a R2ish (maybe 1.5) foam pad. If I am using it more than 2 nights and it's pushing the limits. Down clothing is a bad idea as it loses loft from body moisture. At that point either synthetic insulation (like primaloft pants and jacket, which are much more bulky or fleece, also more bulky, or simply a vapor barrier liner and my long John's is the best option). Vapor barrier allows me to pack less insulation and also protects the down from moisture which reduces its warmth over days if you can't thoroughly dry it in above freezing temps. I actually find the bag is almost too warm above freezing. Last trip I used it on it was right around freezing overnight on that setup (no down clothing)and I had to open the bag. Dont skimp on your pad, it makes a huge difference. I never had a pad above R4 (plus foamie under pad, so R5-6) but my summer airpad is like R2... And when I use that around or below freezing I might as well be sleeping on an aluminum shelf in a freezer.

If they are still the same level of quality. I wouldn't hesitate. Absolutely phenomenal 20F bag for the price. I feel like mine was right around $100. I'm always impressed with how lofty it looks when I unstuff it. I don't think campmor still makes their house brand bags but those were high quality for the price as well. I always wished I'd gotten their summer semi rectangular down bag. To me 650F is kind of the sweet spot. Although I think the campmor were 550F... I used to think higher fill down was more durable but I've since learned lower fill is more resilent. Obviously the advantages of higher fill is lower weight and less volume when packed. But I'm not really an ultralight person (although, with bikepacking, space has become sort of the bane of my existence, backpacking it's not the end of the world unless you need to carry a smaller volume pack).

That seems about right. I don't think it would fit in my 8L sea to summit big river bags. I know I almost froze to death one trip because I couldn't pack it into any of my bikepacking bags (this was a modern bag setup, not a rack setup) and still have space for my other stuff. When I've needed to stuff it down I use a Sea to Summit compression sack that is probably 13L uncompressed. When I bikepack I use a 20L big river for it (on a rack) but that gets all my down insulation (1-2 jackets/pants) and a 850F quilt or 50F summer bag for my dog and his sleepwear/camp wear. Also holds my camp/sleep layers. There's usually room to fold it 3X to seal. So it's definitely bulky. You probably can compress it to about 8L but not sure you can natively stuff it that small. I do believe when I flew somewhere a few years ago I used it and stuffed my down jacket and some other sleep/campwear into one of those 13L (I think that is the size) S2S event compression sacks. And was able to get it aroubd 10L in size. I'd say it will probably compress on its own to 8L in a compression sack.

Gnarly! Sounds like some top tier "type B" fun. Early on in backpacking, after several uncomfortable, borderline worrisome nights sleep in my 20°f Kelty bag I learned the advertised temperature ratings of sleeping bags are actually the "survival rating,", meaning you won't lose any appendages to the elements. The comfort rating is always significantly warmer than the survival rating and you often have to research equipment in advance to find thst figure. I'm PNW-based, and personally, fall-winter I use a rei magma down 15 bag & neoair xtherm pad. I might not ook like Jeremiah Johnson all bundled up but I sleep like a baby. Risking death chasing the bushcraft aesthetic in a cold, damp environment isn't worth it if you lack the ability or materials to craft an adequate sleep system.

I don't know about temps. Just depends what you camp in. General wisdom is to get a bag rated for 10 degrees lower than expected, but Scouts can supplement with more layers in the winter. There is a bit of science and experience needed for that though. I do not recommend 2 bags. A winter bag works just fine in the summer. Just unzip it or just use a blanket if it'll be warm. For any bag, be sure to check the ISO Tested Comfort Rating. - Product names and descriptions are often misleading, even for the big name trusted brands. Kelty didn't provide their ISO Test rating on thier website but they did in response to my email to customer service. - Amazon bags are often unrated so I wouldn't trust them. Bags go on sale a lot. The best bag is often whatever is on sale. I bought bags for me and my kids at the REI outlet website. Hikerdirect.com for Scouts has good bags at good prices. Much of it is Alps Mountaineering, which is a good brand. The Kelty Cosmic line is often recommended as another good budget brand. Coleman still makes good stuff, finding the ratings can be a challenge though. I wouldn't trust anything but a known good brand (that is ISO rated) for winter. A scout won't know if they have a bad bag, they'll just hate cold camping and won't want to go again. Also, the sleeping pad definitely matters for cold weather.