NEMO - Switchback Ultralight Sleeping Pad

I really encourage you to think outside the box here, and reconsider the answers you've gotten so far. This thread so far is 100% indistinguishable from a thread on a non-UL forum. If you are only camping in warm weather, and you're prioritizing weight and durability, then you do not need an inflatable. You'll be committing to a relatively heavy and fragile piece of gear for no reason. And the R values you're looking at are hugely overkill if you'll never go below 5C and you sleep warm. You're the perfect candidate for a foam pad. Cut a ~1 inch thick CCF pad with R=2 to fit your shoulders to your thighs. It will be like 5-6 oz, it will last forever, it will be cheap, it will be comfortable, it doubles as a luxury sit pad, you can stretch out on it, and it can be a framesheet for a frameless pack. If you've only ever tried shitty CCF, try a Switchback or a Zlite. If you really want to prioritize comfort, consider this; an inflatable that even remotely compares in weight to CCF will leak. It's not if, but when. And then you're sleeping on the ground until you make it back to town.

Reducing the pad length is a lot better for comfort than reducing the pad thickness. I chop my Switchback down to only 6 panels, which goes from my shoulders to my thighs. Definitely more comfortable than thinner foam. 1/8" foam on its own is only barely better than nothing. I just put my pack under my legs.  6 panels of Seitchback fit perfectly in the back of my Palante V2, and make for a pretty decent framesheet. It weighs ~5.9 oz Edit: this is such a refreshing comment section, and I've never felt so among friends here before haha. Where are all you people when I'm lone-wolfing it on the constant inflatable threads?!

> isn't the backpack under the legs too uncomfortable? I don't think it is. A frameless pack is just a few layers of fabric when it's empty > Isn't the thickness too different from the ccf? Nah, Switchback or Zlite is 0.9" tall before it's compressed with your body weight. You'll hardly notice the difference. It's way more noticeable with torso-length inflatables, which I also sometimes use. > And isn't the backpack too little insulation? Depends on the temps. Yea your legs will be colder than your torso. It works for me at least to freezing. But you can cut the pad a bit longer to cover your thighs if needed.

> I'd like to not have to buy a whole new pad just for winter, and my understanding is that a high r value pad won't cause you to overheat. Nobody on /r/ultralight here can tell you to use a winter pad in the summer. In UL, we use the lightest pads that can keep us sufficiently warm at a given temp In either case, both of the pads you mention are heavy. > My budget is $200, if there is another sleeping pad that's durable, comfortable, and light in that range I'm happy to consider it You're in luck. A piece of foam (Nemo Switchback or Thermarest Zlite) is $50 or less, weighs between like 5 and 14 oz depending how much you cut it down, and is infinitely more durable than any inflatable. As for comfort, that up to you to decide. And you can't decide that just by looking at it. Get a foam pad out for a few nights and try it, just as any budding UL hiker should. Inflatables are an overwhelming dominance in backpacking, but it really shouldn't be that way.

> lighter and higher r-value than a comparable-length ccf pad A few points here. First, having a higher R value is only a benefit if that higher R value is actually needed. If I'm backpacking in conditions where an R 2 foam pad is sufficient, then the R 4.5 of an Xlite providies no benefit to me. Second, there is no reason to constrain ourselves to comparing these pads at the same length. In UL, "foam pad" almost always means "torso-length foam pad". My 6 panels of Switchback weighs only 6 ounces, which really no inflatable can compete with. Sure you could also cut down an inflatable to even the playing field, but then you introduce a big height differential from one end of your body to the other, which foam doesn't do. and I think that at any temps where a torso pad works, nothing more than R2 is needed, so it may as well be foam. We should also consider that very light inflatables are also fragile. IMO the decision to take such a critical component of a sleep system that can also fail so spectacularly should be made with more care. I would not carry something so fragile unless it was really worth it, and it only becomes worth it at high R value (like 4-5 and above). > OP will likely sleep much better on the inflatable pad You don't know that though. I sleep very well on foam, and so do many others. Maybe OP wouldn't find that to be true for themselves. But torso-length foam has so many benefits over inflatables (lighter, way more durable, way cheaper, more multi-purposed) that all UL hikers should at least try it for a few nights before deciding against it.

I think if you're going foam-only, then it's a great opportunity to shed weight. You can do a lot better than 600 g. My Switchback cut to torso length is 167 g

The R-value of the switchback is super low so won’t provide much insulation plus, if you’re a side sleeper, it’s probably not going to be comfortable at all. Based on the temperatures in your post, you might want to allocate a bit more toward a warmer pad. Edited to add: That bag is crazy heavy if you’re backpacking.

The drawback of high R-value sleeping pads when you are out camping is the bulk and weight of them, not that they get to warm. The other potential drawback is higher cost when you purchase them. R-Value is alos additive. So an option is to get an inflatable pad with a lower R value and add an extra closed cell form pad in the winter. Multiple inflatables can be used too if you get them to stay on each other Tensor™ Extreme is at 710g with R 8.6 at $250 Tensor™ All-Season is at 522g with R 5.4 at $200 Switchback™ Ultralight is closed-cell foam at 415g with R 2 at $60 A tenso All-Season and a switchback have a combined R value of 7.5 at 937g. The mass is 227g more then the Extreme, but if it is not neede the All season is 188g lighter. The prices are from Nemos own websight So an option is a bit lighter sleeping pad for most of the year, but in the winter it is a bit heavier with a bit less R value. Multiple closed cellfome sleeping pads can be used. Multiple of the folfing bumpy one will get a reduced R value because air pockets will get remobed but the flat one you roll will keep the same R value

Comfortable, I have one now. Before I had a Nemo pad I returned and honestly, kind of wish I had kept it. Only downside was it took forever to inflate. Also, these things go on sale/get returned all the time. I’d look for one second hand if possible.

You literally said people in this thread are trying to defend existing purchases, so you’re kind of telling people to buy a new pad. It’s just not a worthwhile upgrade for me when I have a Tensor, Switchback and X-Lite. I don’t need a 4th sleeping pad at home on the shelf lol

The nemo switchback is a bit more comfortable than the z-lite because it has a different dimple structure. I think the comfort benefit of a switchback is worth the increased price compared to an Ozark trail or aliexpress ccf sleeping pad. Additional recommendations: Others have mentioned short or torso length pads, but these certainly aren't for everyone. You should get a full length pad, use it for a few nights, then trial run using the pad shortened without actually cutting the pad. You can do this by just leaving the pad partially folded and sleeping on the unfolded part. The most trimming you should do from the start is just removing sections that are longer than your height. For example if you're 5'6" and the pad is 6' you can take off a couple sections and still have a full body pad. Going along with this, if you use a pillow, because ccf pads are so thin you can put the pillow off the edge of the pad to increase its effective length.

When I did Baker I brought a closed cell pad (Nemo switch back) and an inflatable (Sea to summit) for comfort and redundancy. You'll be hard pressed to find a new bag that's also lightweight for $200. You'll probably need to see if you can find something used or I would recommend you see if you can rent one.

I've used both the switchback and the zlite for multiple thrus. After a few hundred miles, there's little meaningful difference between them However, the switchback is oranger, and therefore better

We just did this and have 4 kids. Some items like a Coleman stove we already had, but here’s what we bought to get started. It adds up but was still so much less than the AirBnb even after campsite fees. We mostly camp in New England hence the sleeping bag choice. Good luck! 1 x NF Wawoma 8 Tent w/ footprint tarp 6 x NF Wawoma 20 Sleeping Bags 4 x Nemo Switchback Sleeping Pads 1 x Exped Queen Megmat

Assuming you are attempting to go ultralight — else why post here? — you should be looking for the lightest pad that is appropriate for the target conditions. Since your intended use is summer, you don’t need a high r-value pad. Getting one would only add unnecessary weight. It will also cost more than a closed cell foam pad, and you mentioned cost as a consideration. So I’d suggest you get something like a Nemo Switchback, cut it down to six panels (about 170g / 6 oz), and *learn* to get comfortable sleeping on that. Comfort is not a fixed point, but can be achieved with a proper mindset and a willingness to practice. You are going to get a lot of non-UL advice on this subreddit, despite the stated focus. (A tell is that they don’t mention weight when making a recommendation.) Don’t spend money on a heavy pad that will move you away from your assumed goal of going ultralight. If you really want an inflatable, look at the Nemo Tensor Elite (240g / 8.5 oz). That’s the lightest inflatable option currently available and is quite comfortable.

I'm just saying all the ccf pads are essentially the same. Yes the decathlon one is better value than the thermarest or Exped or nemo.