Sonos - Playbar

Are you paying for the Atmos and higher end audio from streaming services? If not, the Arc would never be the right buy. I’m pretty sure based on what you’ve said you may have liked the old Playbar. I just picked one up as a Goodwill used electronic for $100 through their online auctions. I had it before the first gen Arc, but always felt for general stereo content the Playbar was far better.

I also use the Playbar, and I’m unsure about upgrading to the Arc Ultra. My current TV (LG OLED B6) doesn’t support Dolby Atmos, and I would also need to replace the rear speakers

Thank you for your advice. I really appreciate it. I’ll stick with the Playbar since my TV doesn’t support Dolby Atmos, and it’s not something that interests me enough to change the TV and the entire home theater setup. Besides, not having AirPlay on the Playbar isn’t an issue for me either.

I can confirm. I used to use Sonos, for non critical listening it sounds great. The reason is because it doesn’t fail at anything audio wise, nor does it do anything mind blowing. It kinda just merges into the background and lets the TV or visuals take center stage. This is how it should be for movies imo, the audio immersive but not doing too much. For music I found this quality to make the Sonos feel dry and boring

Yep. Not a whisper of either. And the photo leaks seem to have that same single HDMI port. I can’t warrant the spend to upgrade the Playbar without them. I skipped the Arc for exactly the same reasons. Infuriating really.

I get that but space is the limiting factor I’m afraid. I just don’t have any room in the lounge for an AV Amp and speakers. Let alone a dedicated room for home theatre! At the time of the Playbar it did more or less what was needed….now I think expectations for premium soundbars are different in 2024 (look at LG soundbar specs for instance). Maybe I’m an edge case. Limited space and a requirement to get the most out of physical media or remux copies with a Sonos ecosystem and Sonos soundbar set up….

I've had the playbar for 7 years. I also have the Sonos sub and ones. It definitely is behind on almost everything the new soundbars can do. However, last year I bought a Samsung 990 with sub and surrounds and was very excited to hear how much better it is than my playbar. Well after 2 weeks I returned the Samsung and am still using the playbar. To me it sounds fuller and the vocals especially mens voices sound way richer. It may be my room dimensions and high ceiling I don't know, but my advice would be to get the Samsung and keep the playbar until your sure you like the new setup better.

I have a Sonos Beam in the office and then living room I’m still rocking the OG Sonos Playbar. I’d like to get the Sub to go with them or upgrade at some point but they sound good still so I figured why waste money at this point

I highly recommend a Sonos Playbar from OfferUp for around the $350 range

I have a used Sonos Playbar with (2) One SL surrounds and sounds amazing for music. Definitely could use a sub but not really needed for the music I listen to

Yeah I don’t want to speak for the dime a dozen no name speaker bars, but I’ve had several systems like the PlayBar, Arc, and now the Samsung Q990D. Our vacation home has one room pre wired for HT so we’ve compared a 5.1 receiver setup in that room before. Honestly those high end sound bars are quite competitive. They sound better than the HT-in-a-box Denon speakers the house came with. Even with I replaced those with better Klipsch bookshelves, I would say the Arc immersive set and the Q990D still outperform for movies and TV though not for music. Plus you can’t really beat the ease of setup. If you have space for 4 power cables around the room right next to each speaker, you can have a 7.1.2 setup. Some of the latest sound bars can wirelessly transmit eArc equivalent audio without an HDMI cable to the bar even. I’ve been to many houses with a budget soundbar and yeah those sound awful, but you often hear people claiming any AV receiver setup beats even good sound bars and that’s simply not been my experience.

Should listen old model - Sonos Playbar. Perfect!

I’m sticking with my 15 year old playbar, sub, and play 1s 😂

THIS RIGHT HERE. the playbar will forever be the champ. i don't think they'll ever top it

OP go on eBay and buy a used Sonos Play Bar for around 200 bucks and use optical in. I have nice speakers and a couple hifi setups and still like my play bars on 2 TVs

Laughing at this picture. Should I get 2 inch bookshelf awkward speakers or like a beefy Sonos play bar for 200 bucks that fits perfectly

You haven't heard the Playbar then. As OP says, it still can't match 2 speakers paired for stereo... but it's fantastic for casual music listening. I'd argue better than a single Five because of the stereo separation.

Considering the original Arc wasn't as rich sounding as the Playbar, I remain skeptical until an actual audio writer submits a review.

I have a beam, a playbar, and an arc. The beam is plenty for a bedroom and would be my choice if I didn’t already have some older playbars for the bedrooms.

With Arc also they said same thing for tinny voice...no fix until end of its pathetic life cycle...Ultra started repeating the same...basically Sonos does not know how to apply fixes with Dolby Atmos sound bars...Playbar is great

Going to upgrade to Playbar..yes..holding arc and now ultra ..ultra seems little better...but when u consider pleasant listening without tinny voice....200$ Vizio and playbar are ultimate..not sure what Ultra does excellent with respect to tinny voice. One more waste from Sonos like Arc..why ultra was shrinked in size while adding new drivers....could be due to useless small sized drivers....horrible..no mid range even in ultra.....Playbar is ultimate

The Sonos Playbar was a decent soundbar...10 years ago. If you want the best bang for the buck: Samsung Q990D. If you really want the best system available and money is no issue: Either Sony Theatre Quad or Sonos Arc Ultra with 2 Subs and 2 Era 300s as Surrounds.

I've got a play bar, sub (gen 1), and two play1s in the basement, and they still sound fantastic.

*****UPDATE NOVEMBER 2, 2024 ***** Apologies if this isn’t how I’m supposed to update. This is honestly my first real post on here. Update: After three cycles of uninstalling, reinstalling, resetting, and rebooting—and opting for a quick Trueplay tuning instead of the advanced—I finally got the system set up as it’s supposed to be. I had to work through issues where Sonos didn’t recognize my architectural speakers and kept refusing to move forward, but persistence paid off. Here’s the verdict: Initial Out-of-the-Box Experience (Arc Ultra, Gen 4 Sub, Sonos Amp, original in-ceiling architectural speakers): • Setup Experience: 2.5/10 • Music Sound Quality: 4/10 • Theater Sound Experience: 5/10 The app continuously froze and wouldn’t allow for a retune, making the initial setup frustrating. Original Playbar Setup (from memory): • Initial Experience: 8/10 (It was new and exciting—a soundbar! How innovative!) • Music Sound Quality: 6.5/10 • Theater Sound Experience: 7.5/10 This was with the original Playbar, Gen 1 Sub, Connect:Amp Gen 1, and the same Sonance in-ceiling speaker pairs. Arc Ultra After Troubleshooting: • Reading through comments and advice: 9/10 • Frustrating multi-hour troubleshooting, resets, and setup cycles: 2.5/10 (I really didn’t think it was going to work by the third cycle) • Music Sound Quality: 8/10 • Theater Sound Experience: 9/10 Beolab 18s and 19 Sub Setup in the Same Room: • Setup Experience: 5/10 • Music Quality: 9.5/10 • Theater Sound Experience: 6/10 So there we have it. The out-of-the-box experience was defective and terrible, and the troubleshooting was frustrating—I almost gave up. But now I agree: it’s a great system when it works and is properly set up. I’m keeping in mind that it probably (and hopefully) sounds even better with an advanced Trueplay tuning that works. For those out there who had a “meh” music experience or a similarly frustrating introduction to the Ultra, I hope it turns out like it did for me! I don’t want to repeat the setup process ever again, but I’m having fun with it now. (My wife is about to kill me for the amount of random music and movies I’ve subjected her to on what was supposed to be a quiet Saturday!) I hope this update helps anyone else who’s experiencing similar issues. Persistence pays off, and the end result is worth it! *****ORIGINAL POST NOVEMBER 1, 2024***** As a long-time audio enthusiast, I’ve invested significantly in high-end systems. In my living room, I currently have a Bang & Olufsen 2.1 setup with Beolab 18s and a Beolab 19, which I use primarily for music—they excel in that area but have multiple challenges when it comes to TV and movies (don’t get me started on that). In my family room, I have a pair of Beolab 20s, also primarily for music. I also have a pair of Beolab 9s in another room—these were the first high-end speakers I got after moving on from my old Infinity Alphas and Betas with Onkyo amps, which feels like a former life now. For watching TV and movies, I’ve been using Sonos Playbar-based setups in both rooms. Each setup includes a Playbar, a Sub, a Connect Amp, and two Sonance in-ceiling speakers. While these Playbar-based setups couldn’t rival my B&O systems for music, they were impressive for their price point and worked well for TV and movies, delivering solid, enjoyable sound. Having both the B&O and Sonos setups running simultaneously allowed me to directly compare them, and the Sonos setups held their own surprisingly well given the cost difference. However, my wife isn’t a fan of having multiple setups in both rooms. I was hoping that the Sonos Arc Ultra could be our solution and compromise—a single “acceptable” system that satisfies both our needs (and a sad farewell to my B&Os). Consolidating to one setup would simplify things and make both of us happier. After setting up the Arc Ultra and Sub 4, using Trueplay tuning, and then giving the system a thorough run, I directly compared it to my B&O setups and the previous Playbar system. Unfortunately, the results have been incredibly disappointing. This isn’t just about missing bass—the sound from my system is overall underwhelming and lower quality than I expected. Music listening on the Arc Ultra has been “meh” at best. It feels like an overall downgrade compared to both my B&O systems and even the old Playbar and Gen 1 Sub. It seems that my Arc Ultra system is nerfed and has a definite issue. I’m glad to hear that most users with new systems are having wonderful experiences. However, seeing comments that dismiss the concerns of those experiencing similar problems as merely “whining” or being “infatuated with bass” is frustrating. For those of us facing real issues, such remarks feel dismissive and unhelpful. I’ve noticed that a minority of others seem to be experiencing similar problems. For those of us dealing with this, it’s clear that something isn’t right. Sonos, please acknowledge and address this issue. The Arc Ultra and Gen 4 Sub should not sound worse than the Playbar and Gen 1 Sub—this product should deliver the high-quality experience it’s advertised to provide.

Arc + sub is pretty sick for music. Better than the Beam 2 I use in the dining room, but it beats the Arc without a sub hands down. Old Playbars still crank out tunes if it’s placed right. I have one almost on floor level on the bottom of an open tv stand (Samsung Atmos soundbar above it on shelf 2 for TV) and it BOOMS, but another Playbar on the wall above a TV does not. Arc Ultra with 300s and Sub 4 is best, but I have a couple 300s alone in the kitchen and music room which are really nice and of course the Move 2 is great but not as great as everything else listed.

To be fair some are okay, if you’re space-constrained picking up a used Sonos Playbar could cost a few hundred units of currency and you’ll get a pretty nice sound. I can’t say the same about their extortionately priced new stuff.

the cheapest Sonos system is a bundle of previous gen components: Playbar ($250 used), pair of Sonos Ones($100-150 x2 used/refurb), optional Sub mini ($429). That's more like $1k total, if you're willing to skip the sub (the Playbar actually has pretty good mid-bass, *better* than the Arc non-Ultra). You lose out on Atmos and e-arc and some other modern features (Playbar is like decade old) but it's a very capable traditional home audio setup and sounds fantastic. This is what I have in living room- even Playbar + pair of Sonos Ones sounds fantastic at \~$500 total. I ended up adding a Sub Gen 3 and a pair of Fives in my office though lol, so I got got.

Honestly, the Arc Ultra is a step up from the Arc for sure, but that Playbar just has this warmth and presence that's hard to beat for pure music listening. This is a good review, btw

A little background...I've owned just about every possible Sonos speaker there is. Currently have the Arc+Sub3+Era300 in my living room, Beam2+SubMini in my family room, Move 2 in my kitchen/backyard, a Five in the dining room, and my first and favorite Sonos speaker, the Playbar+SubMini. in my garage (for when I'm in there working). I love the sound of the Playbar, for both movies and music, as it was the perfect combination for both. The reason I don't use it in the house is it doesn't support AirPlay, which I use frequently to play music in multiple rooms. When it's just me in the garage, I use the app to stream music. I listen to all types of music, from EDM (with friends), pop (my kids), rock, lots of 80's and 90's music (yes, I'm old), some hip-hop (think 90's rap), and even country. I'm not an audiophile, but I've always been into high end audio speakers and headphones. I got the Arc Ultra last week when it just released to replace the OG Arc in my living area. I listen to music daily in the living/dining room. Having spent some good hours listening to the Arc Ultra, wanted to share my thoughts specifically for music. I'll get my overall summary out of the way first...overall, the Arc Ultra is an improvement over the OG Arc, but still doesn't compare to the Playbar for stereo content (Atmos obviously can't be compared) Arc Ultra vs OG Arc: * It's better than the Arc...in some ways more than others. When it's used as a standalone, you will first notice how much more bass the Ultra produces. I was very impressed by the punchiness of the bass. All genres of music sounded better. * Vocally, one big difference I could hear when comparing the two, is that on the OG Arc, vocals primarily played through the center channel speaker (simulated surround sound). On the Ultra, the vocals are coming from the left and right channel speakers, playing in true stereo. This of course is using either AirPlay or the app playing non-Atmos music. Stereo separation sounded decent. * There's still a bit of muddiness to both the mid and highs, both on the Ultra and OG Arc. I was hoping to get better midrange,, but it was only marginally improved. The highs, while slightly crisper, still didn't hit me the way the Playbar does (more on that later). * When in comes to Dobly Atmos music, the Arc Ultra is an improvement. By switching out the mid drivers for tweeters on both the side and upward firing speakers, there's a better affect to the surround sounds on the Ultra. When standing at the sweet spot and listening to the Ultra, you can hear the sounds firing on the sides and top a bit better. Don't expect too much of an improvement, but it's noticeable on certain tracks. I'm not big on Atmos music as you have to use the Sonos app for it. This will change if/when Airplay allows for Atmos. * When I added the Sub3+Era300, musically, things improved, but not by much over the OG Arc. Like others have mentioned, the bass is nerfed on the Sub3. I believe this is due to the fact that the Ultra is still producing a good amount of bass, even with the Sub3 added. Yes there's more bass output overall, but when compared to the OG Arc, the sound improvement is marginal. Arc Ultra vs Playbar * Like I mentioned earlier, my favorite Sonos speaker was the Playbar. It was what got me started down this Sonos rabbit hole. At the time, I loved it for both movies and music, and still do for music. * When comparing both soundbars for music, the Playbar still wins out. In many of the songs I listened to, the Playbar just sounded better. I used the Sonos app and played stereo music for comparison. There's a richness to the sound of the Playbar that can't be matched by the smaller drivers in the Arc. * Yes it can't play Dolby Atmos, but I never cared for that much. I'm all about a good listening experience, and the Playbar sounds better to my ears. There's a certain sound signature to it that I can't quite explain. The Arc Ultra, like the Arc, has a bit of muddiness that isn't present on the Playbar. * Ultra wins out on bass output, that is no surprise. The Sound Motion tech is great. But that's not to say the Playbar can't produce a good amount of bass. It does. And it's very well balanced. * The Playbar sound is comparable to the Five. Both are musically great. Arc Ultra for movies (my quick take) * Ultra sounds better for Atmos content. The tweeters is a marked improvement for the surrounds and upward firing speakers. * Vocal clarity is there, as many other mentioned. I always thought it was a joke that we had to turn on speech enhancement on the OG Arc just to get decent dialogue (and it still didn't sound that clear). Ultra is an improvement. * I have to turn up the bass on Sub3 to get decent bass coming from it. I believe software improvement will remediate this issue, as the Ultra still tries to produce too much bass by itself. Overall I'm happy and will likely keep the Ultra. I'm hoping some software updates will improve on the sound. But music wise, I still prefer the Playbar (I guess I'm old school like that..lol).

Exactly my assessment. If anyone used the Playbar before, they should notice the difference in fidelity. The Playbar was that good. Bigger mid drivers goes a LONG way in producing better mid range sounds.

No it's not. However, the Playbar was wonderful to listen to for music. Better than most soundbars I've tried. Still can't match 2 speakers paired for stereo.

My Playbar continues to make me happy after all these years. In fact, I was so out of touch when it came to TV interface news, that when our 8 year old LG died and I was looking at C4s, I was afraid it wouldn’t have an optical out. Was *SO* relieved to learn new TVs still do.

That’s awesome. My old LG B4a didn’t get along well with the Playbar after the TV came out of standby. Sound would occasionally not output from the optical port and I’d have make sure the TV was powered all the way down. That problem is gone on the C4. Edit: I actually never determined whether the issue was at the optical output or the HDMI input or somewhere in between.

Yeah my dad has the play bar with two play 5’s and the gen 2 sub. That system sounds MILES better than my arc, 2 era 300’s and gen 3 sub. I’m like… wtf am I doing wrong? This dude’s set up sounds like a movie theater and the music is insane on it. My music coming from the arc sounds like dog water sometimes. Muddied vocals is the perfect phrase

I would agree. I have the old Sony XBR 900a with the big build it speakers in the front of the panel and even with those it was hard to hear the voices most the time. Added an old Sonos playbar and it's so much easier to hear. Nothing compared to my old house where I had my 7.2.4 setup but the landlord won't let me cut into the walls at this new rental. Still prefer my AVR and real speakers.

I have both Sonos and Bose . I have Bose 900 Bose 500 and Sonos arc and playbar. Both have their pros and cons but based on Sonos edging out Bose on sound quality and the app I used to recommend them more based on software alone. I was close to upgrading my whole home to Sonos until the app update that caused all the headaches. To this day the app is terrible and the soundbars have so many issues connecting that I don’t even want to use it anymore . Say what you want about Bose but the app is basic and it just works.

This is a very good point. Where Sonos really clicks is when you get a few speakers around the house where you start getting sound reinforcement. I have a spot by my front door that gets positively brutal levels of bass when my playbar and sub combines with the admittedly giant altec a5x voice of the theatre system in the living room.

Kept my old playbar and just got a C4. Love it. Took me a bit to figure out how to program the remote to cooperate with the playbar IR but it all now works perfect.

I agree. I have had all three and would rate them 1) Playbar 2) Beam Gen 2 3) Arc The playbar isn’t the best for voices but it is the best sounding overall.

I had a playbar then a beam gen2. Both great. Arc ultra got sent straight back. It was horrible. You need a cinema room with acoustics to make it sound good. Living rooms are better with play bar and beams

Thanks for your review. I’m still rocking the playbar and prefer the sound signature to the original arc for music and movies alike but I’m considering finally upgrading playbar to arc ultra.. part of me worries though that I still will prefer the sound of the playbar even for movies. Do you think the arc ultra still has that arc sound signature that feels ‘tinny’ or thin?

I previously left a review over a year ago of me A/B testing my playbar to the original Arc and after a few weeks decided to return the Arc in favor of the playbar surround setup. I found that I had preferred the sound signature of the playbar to hollow, tinny, harsh sound of arc. Just got my Arc Ultra and tested it back to back with my playbar with music, TV, and ready player one 4k bluray. My initial reaction is how the ultra makes the playbar sound very muddy. Ultra’s frequency response is much much more balanced than the playbar and even the original Arc and I believe it’s a big upgrade over both the previous flagship soundbars. I have a pretty big open floor plan with my tv room joined with my kitchen so I worried that the small drivers on the ultra would still feel harsh and not full but my doubts and concerns are alleviated. This is such a relief for me as I was disappointed with the Arc to where I ended up returning it. This is not the case with the ultra. My playbar served me well but it’s time to take it down. Currently have one sls and sub gen 3. Will be adding era 300s or might wait to see if we get Era ultras with sound motion tech coming soon. Will report back.

The sound was nailed with the first gen so why change it? They are still a company and believe it or not some people don’t like to buy 4-6 year old hardware even if they’re flawless. And also they get latest wifi, being able to connect two subs came with the third gen if i’m not mistaken.

I have a Sonos Play Bar + Sub and two Play 1s for rear surround... for what it is, a clean simple wireless 5.1 (ish) setup it's great imo. Been super happy with it.. and I was a die hard 7.1 separate amps, lots of wiring etc person.. the sonos is not the same caliber as a full on atmos setup obv but I enjoy mine daily. That sub is no slouch and you can add two of them now.

I’m honestly still very impressed with the Playbar. I don’t watch a lot of movies and Atmos have not been impressed by simulated Atmos. For music and streaming shows the playbar is unbeatable especially since they can be found for 200-300 on marketplace

Someone with excellent taste!!! And i bought the OLED Sony A80J, and for a time even had a PS5. The house looked like Sony fanboy lived there lol I love this bastard, i would even play dolby atmos songs on apple music. I was happy with my Sonos playbar for 3 yrs, and then fell in at atmos hole thanks to some girl band that released their cd on atmos format. Ultimately didn't like that mix after all, but movies and atmos though, mama!!! Ready Player One, Batman vs Superman, Dune... fucking epic!!!

> Then, when I purchased it, I realised I'd been had by all these people who had never owned a play bar I have a Playbar and Arc You NEED to manually crank the bass and treble on the Arc in settings, it's flat out of the box or using Truplay (I don't use Truplay anymore), after you do that, it's a little better than the Playbar (which I love)

Still happy with my playbar. I’m super skeptical about a soundbar being advertised as delivering 9.1.4 on its own. Marketing magic.

I’ve had both, including the Sonos One as surrounds and the Sonos subwoofer too. I was a huge fan of the Playbar with the full spec - back then (2017-2020) you had to manually switch between stereo and 5.1 for surround sound. The Q990 is definitely a step up, can switch automatically based on the input codec (stereo, 5.1 or Atmos), is great value for money if you can nab one on sale, and is terrific Atmos wise. Ive never tried the newer Sonos system in all its glory as the Samsung was too tempting as a full system vs the Sonos Arc only price tag wise. Atmos support is growing apps wise and will only continue to keep growing. Music wise I’m not a huge fan of Atmos but fingers crossed that continues to improve too.

I have a gen1 beam paired with a gen1 sub and a playbar. I actually think the playbar sounds better than the beam even without the sub. So would theoretically replace the beam with an arc ultra in my movie room. One question, how much separation and virtual surround would I notice if my movie room is a 200 sq ft rectangle?

It is amazing how much better the playbar is than the arc at music

I’ve got no problem with innovation and product development. What I don’t really understand is the persistent need to have the latest thing. If I was starting out (and had the readies) then this might be an option. But I’ve got a very lovely Playbar at home which gives great sound with the help of a pair of OneSLs. I certainly don’t feel the need to spend a grand on something that no doubt is better but basically does exactly the same job but with bells and whistles. But I’m old and don’t care who knows it! Now, let me buy an iPhone 16.

LG B6, and I bought a Sonos Play Bar, 2 Play 1's as surrounds, and a Sonos Amp shortly after. I can't remember if that was '17 or '18. I honestly could not be happier with the whole setup aside from the burn in I experienced with the TV. The Sonos speakers were easy and convenient to set up, are easy to control, and I have not experienced a single issue with them in all these years. I am fortunate to have not experienced the current crop of issues that so many are having with the new app. I am no audiofile, but I feel the Sonos speakers sound fantastic for what they are. I'm not one to tinker endlessly with sound settings, so when combined with their simplicity it's a great product for me. I say this as someone who typically hates tech products that are needlessly made obsolete due to software or other preventable issues. I decided going in that I was buying into Sonos knowing my speakers may have a 10 year life span, just like the OLED probably wouldn't last forever based on the possibility of burn in (in hindsight that happened way faster than I bargained for). Eventually I'd like to upgrade to a 77" TV, but I'm still wary of the burn in, though I know it's a lot less of an issue with the new TVs. I'm also tempted to upgrade the Playbar to an Arc with Era 300's as surrounds to give Atmos a shot, but I'm wary after this whole app debacle and the way Sonos has handled it. Coming from an ancient and small LCD prior to 2017, I think the things that improved my movie and TV viewing experience ranked from the greatest improvement to least would be: Playbar, then sub, then surrounds, then bigger OLED TV.

100% agree with this. I had an original Sonos Playbar, two Sonos Play 1 and Gen 1 Sonos sub and the sound was 10x better than the Q930D is. Really disappointed I sold the Sonos set.

I have two decent bookshelf speakers and a 10” subwoofer and consistently get comments from guests about how good it sounds and they want to get rid of their soundbars. I also have a Sonos Playbar and Sub in another room and I can always hear the dialog but arent doing critically viewing and its great

I currently have a Playbar and Gen 1 sub and am looking to upgrade to an Arc Ultra. I'd keep the sub. I use a Google Streamer with my LG B2. If I upgrade to the Arc Ultra, would I simply plug it in to the TV via eArc and the Streamer via HDMI into the TV?

Playbar has a great standalone sound for music.

True. I say that Playbar as a soundbar has a great (just great, not greater than …for example Nautilus sound system or as you said Nakimichi) sound even without surrounds. Yeah, sub might be needed but for those who loves it in music.

Yes, exactly how I expected the ultra would be , disappointingly so . ( mildly better than the Arc) I had much higher hopes. Sonos didn't listen to staff. They don't listen to what customers want and don't seem to care either. I also have Playbar, Arc 300's and Sub , and agree on the Playbar's musical prowess. Won't go near the ultra or any Sonos for some time yet ,if at all. Ps, Never enough tech pretty much nails it on the muddiness of the Ultra, and he was just making a prediction based on there being too many drivers in the space . I'll be interested if his actual review follows his prediction.

The playbar just has better sound than the Arc overall. Unfortunately, this seems to be true for the ultra as well.

It's funny. For me it was different. I went from TV speaker to beam Gen 2 and was impressed. Then my Dad got a cheaper but not bad "Dolby Atmos" Soundbar. I realized that the true secret sauce is Trueplay. That is what's makes the Sonos Bar better Imho. Overall, if you want to have better surround while not spending to much money, get a pair of Ikea Bookshelves and use them as surrounds. Your Beam will then have more headroom as it doesn't need to simulate the rears anymore

Yep, that spot is just screaming for a Sonos bar.