Salomon - Genesis

I am very disappointed by version 3, it is a completely different shoe, with a very high stack height and ridiculously soft cushioning. I switched to the Salomon Genesis (not the S-lab version), which is much closer to the Ultra glide 2. I actually prefer it because the lugs are 4,5mm instead of 3,5mm which makes them better in mud.

I'm 210lbs. Always a Salomon user. Very good results with many of their models, last years the Ultra glide 2, now changing to the Genesis model. (I don't like the Ultra glide 3, much higher and with a ridiculous amount of cushion) I don't do that many miles on them because I tend to wear out the thread early (technical terrain) but the soles always hold up very very well.

FYI: I’m a very wide boy, but the Salomon Speedcross and Genesis both fit very comfortably. None of their other shoes do, but those are both great shoes you might want to try. Hoka also has nice wide options across their lineup. If it‘s grip you want, I find the Speedgoat is second only to VJ Shoes - but VJ run narrow.

both the vanilla and slab genesis are good shoes but very different from the speedcross - one won't necessarily translate to the other. But worth a try.

Yeah I’ve been through 2 pairs and they only have about 100-200 good rocky US northeast running miles in them. I'm chonky for a trail runner though (190lb). The wet rock grip is atrocious anyway so I’ve moved on, however they are the still the comfiest shoe I’ve worn so it’s a shame about the outsole. Have a look at the Genesis for a more modern outsole.

Ultra glides are my vote for mixed use. The smaller lugs are nicer on road. I use the sense ride 5, ultra glide 2 and just finished a pair of the Genesis non-pro version and those were great for trail but I don’t think I would care for them on road.

Two of my tops [La Sportiva Prodigio](https://www.lasportivausa.com/prodigio.html) - Nice comfortable wider toe box. Some have mentioned the Pro I have yet to try. [Salomon Genesis](https://www.salomon.com/en-us/product/genesis-li5372) - Would wear on more technical terrain, more snug fitting and plush than Prodigio. Want to try the [Nnormal Kjerag 02](https://www.nnormal.com/en_US/content/kjerag-02)

There is no such thing as "the best" running shoe. Every running shoe company is making great shoes right now, and they all have a wide range of options. Like, Hoka ain't the only brand making cushy shoes, and Brooks isn't the only one with daily trainers. What matters is what fits your feet and body and goals. I've found Saucony consistently fits me well. I have their Triumph 21 for a daily trainer. Endorphin Speed 3 and Kinvara 13 for speed work outs. Hurricane 24 for recovery. I also have Asics Superblast 2 for long runs, and Salomon Genesis for trails

Yeah the 4 with the Vibram looks promising. How nimble are the 3? My area is a lot of single track with roots, and my Peregrine 13 perform well there but are due for replacement. I'm also doing longer trail days, so would like a bit more cushion, but not sure how well a higher stack shoe might perform when I'm tap dancing around roots. The Peregrine 15 are a little more cushioned than 13, so might be good. I've also tried on Salomon Genesis and liked them but my local store didn't have any XUs. I've been enjoying high stack road shoes so kind of leaning that way for trail comfort just need to stay a bit agile

I'm currently looking to replace my aging Peregrine 13, plus get a bit more cushion. I liked the extra cushion on the 15s, thought they felt nice in store Salomon Genesis (the standard model, not s/lab) has a pretty similar midsole feel to the 15, maybe a tiny bit softer. Upper feels slightly more plush/padded in the Genesis. I've tried on other Salomons before and found them too narrow, but the Genesis felt great for me, and probably what I'll go with

Peregrine or Salomon genesis (non slab) and ultra glide 3 (non slab) are often discounted and are a good option for what you are describing. I would recommend against the pulsar slab and the la sportiva. They look cool but they are racing shoes which won't hold up very well and won't be comfortable or stable on easy runq

SLab was too narrow in the midfoot for me, it has quite a high arch. The Genesis is still a wonderful show in its own right, very capable, but the SLab feels a little more premium and slightly bouncier in the midsole.

I’m not surprised that you’re rolling your ankle with the Endorphin Trail, that shoe got discontinued almost as soon as it was released. It is quite high stack, rockered but also very firm, so I would imagine it is very hard to stay on top of the shoe. My favourite right now is Salomon Genesis (not the SLab version). It’s very well balanced. Mid-stack, agile, neutral, grippy and tough. The midsole is soft enough for comfort but not too squishy. Upper feels super locked in but not aggressively narrow. It basically just lets your foot do what it wants, unlike the Endo Trail which is prescriptive and throws you off if you don’t run the way it wants you to run.

You are so right. It is the spiritual successor to the Sense Ride 3. Slightly softer, slightly more secure, slightly more mountain focussed. Basically improved in all ways!

If you like Salomon shoes and their relatively narrow fit, I’d give the Genesis (regular or S/LAB) a try.

I have the same problem as you and the shoes that block my heel best are the NNormal Kjerag and various Salomon models such as the Genesis

They are good everywhere except wet rocks on technical trails

I have run 10+ hours on trabuco 13s. In very technical high altitude terrain. Wide, cushioned enough without being soft so they work well on technical terrain, rock plate, and one of the best grips in the market. The upper is quite poor, in 250km in rough terrain the shoe looks awful, but still in use. Asics sent me a replacement pair. I tried lots of pairs looking for that long technical race. Nothing really was so confortable so I ended with my trusted trabucos. Maybe a v11 or v12 will work better in high mountain races, more durable upper and better lug pattern for rocky terrain, but less runnable. Pairs I tried, and ditched for not being wide/confortable enough to my foot: Mafate 4 speed, Topo MTN racer 3, Sportiva akasha 2, Salomon génesis (and slab genesis), Hierro v9, Zegama 2 (wide enough, but doesn't work for anything really technical, I use them for easy runs), Tomir 2.0 (weird sensation with the insoles)

Agree, it really depends on how fast, how far, the ratio of road to trail etc. my Saucony Tempus are pretty good on park run trails and “fire track” style roads. Puma shoes with their Puma Grip are great in the rain or on slightly uneven terrain. Then you have what some call Commuter shoes - road to trail shoes with lower lug depth and softer midsole. Hoka’s Challenger ATR isn’t bad, and the Tecton X and X2 had proper gravel lugs that worked well, along with shows like the Saucony Xodus Ultra, Nike Terra Kiger or Pegasus Trail. Personally I’ve just run in road shoes if it’s dry, and I trust my trail shoes (currently Salomon Genesis and Hoka Mafate 5) in the wet or more technical terrain.

Hello. As a lot of people say, a good road shoe will be good on the hard packed trails as well. But if you want a bit more traction and security, go with something that has a good foam and a smaller lugs. Options I’ve run in and like include: - Hoka Mafate Speed 4 / Tecton X - Salomon Genesis / Ultra Glide - La Sportiva Prodigio Pro - Merrell Agility Peak 5 - Brooks Catamount 4 - Saucony Xodus Ultra 1 / 2 (avoid the 3) For reference I am 85kg and usually run 30km / week.

Hoka Mafate 5 is comfy and fun. Mafate Speed 4 is still good but a little narrower and not quite so bouncy. I used to run in Speedgoats a lot but think the 5 & 6 are missing some comfort and the foam isn’t returning the energy of newer shoes. Salomon Genesis or Ultra Glide are both good if you can accommodate a narrower fit. I prefer the protection of the Genesis over the Ultra Glide. Prodigio Pro is also fun and bouncy, but much lighter, less protection around the ankle and so a bit more stripped back. Everyone I know loves them though. Hoka Tecton X 3 is a similar proposition to the Prodigio but both are spendy. Hoka is slightly more stable and bouncy but there is very little in it. If you want the best outsole rubber money can buy, look at the VJ Ultra 3. Seriously, the lugs and rubber is like glue. Finally, the Saucony Xodus Ultra is a good shoe for distances like this. It’s also comfy and protective. Just avoid the 2 or 3 and go for the latest version 4.

Oh I use “shoe rotation” as a regular excuse to buy more shoes, but in the real world I have: - shoe for trails and ultras (Salomon Genesis currently) - shoe for technical and short trails (Hoka Zinal 2) - shoe for gravel / road to trail (Hoka Tecton X) - shoe for deep or thick mud (Inov8 X-Talon Ultra) - shoe for OCR racing (VJ Spark)

Okay, so based on how you describe these issues, i think you have a pretty narrow foot, but i'm confused by the fact that you like the Hierro - this is pretty wide fitting and "plush" cushioned. SO maybe i have that wrong. But the best fitting shoes in the industry come from VJ. They have an amazing fitlock system which is peak stability. They have brilliant outsole rubber for technical trails, roots and wet rocks. They are epic for OCRs and orienteering. However, the midsole is usually a bit firm and numb, so they're not fit for road-to-trail. I've run in Ultra3 and Sparks, and if you're a lighter, smaller runner they will probably be fine. Alternatively, look at Salomon - the S/Lab Speed, Ultra, Genesis, etc are all narrow but have great lockdown. You have to persist with the lace system - sometimes you have to play with the lockdown 2-3 times before it all sits right, but I've loved running in the CDW Genesis for the last year.

As many people have said here, the SG6 is too firm and has lost some of its “fun”. The Merrell Agility Peak 5 is a good option. The Saucony Xodus Ultra 1 / 2 are great. Miss version 3. Version 4 is supposed to be a return to form. Salomon Genesis is a good shoe I’ve run 200km in but runs narrow. I am loving the Mafate 5 but it’s a marmite shoe for this community I’ve noticed. La Sportiva Prodigeo Pro has a lot of fans but the midsole is less stable, more bouncy and it’s not cheap. The North Face Vectiv Series are decent now - there’s a lot to choose from. Final option if you want great outsole grip is the VJ Ultra 3. Fab lockdown too.