VJ - Ultra 3

Have you tried the Maxx2? I have both and find the Ultra 3 is a little bit of a liability on really technical downhills. I never realized how often I’m stepping on narrow points and ridges on boulders until trying the Ultra3’s. The additional stack and compression was a bit disconcerting when precise foot placement and precarious balancing on small surfaces was needed. The Maxx2 is a dream under these circumstances. That being said, the Ultra 3 is likely a better overall performer on a 50k or longer distance where outright technical performance isn’t the main priority. The Maxx2 has enough cushion for a 50k too, but the Ultra3 has more and feels faster and more propulsive in flatter terrain.

I like VJ Maxx2 for really technical stuff up to that distance. Lot of people might want some more cushion though. Recently started running in the VJ Ultra 3, too. Equally great grip, but with more cushion to help with the comfort on longer runs. Added stack definitely compromises stability for fast running on boulders etc., but the effect would be lessened at more typical (slower) 50k pace.

My two current favorites for technical rocky trails are Arcteryx Norvan SL3 and VJ Maxx2. For the 50k distance I’d give the nod to the VJs. Norvans are super light and nimble. VJs offer more protection and better grip but are a little heavier and slightly less precise. I might also consider the VJ Ultra 3 for a 50k. I find the extra squishiness and taller stack to be a liability over the other two when trying to run fast (particularly downhill) on super technical terrain. But at 50k pace that liability is likely to diminish and the extra padding will be nice. These feel way faster on flat non-technical terrain than the other two too. Maybe it’s the rocker design or some propulsion from the extra foam.

Had them both, ended up with the La Sportiva. VJ ultra 3 has slightly higher stack and a roomier toe box (but still a nicely snug mid foot and heel). While being lower stack, the Prodigio Pro has a slightly peppier feel I the foam. Both have VERY good grip, with a slight edge to the VJ. Both are better than Vibram Megagrip, and both are surprisingly durable. The reason why I sold my VJ Ultra 3s was the rough upper digging into the sides of my ankle. This is supposed to get better with time but for me it was simply too painful. Should be obvious on a first fitting though. Apparently the next version will redesign that part of the upper, but who knows when that will be released.

VJ shoes are European and from the north not UK though. Just as an alternative. I didn’t run in innov8 so literally purely suggestion based your requirements and as I am super happy with my VJ maxx2 and ultra3.

I also use these in Norway, but on the western coast. I've only ever used them for mountain hiking, and really love them. Great for rocky terrain. I would probably use something a bit bulkier if I were walking through a lot of mud though. I'm very interested to see if they're any good on snow/ice when the winter comes

Just got some VJ Ultra 3 out of necessity because I left home in my slippers to go on a trip. These are hands down the best trail runners I ever owned. I owned in the past several Altra Lone Peaks, some Hoka, Topo Athletics. What I love about the VJs is how light and breathable they are, like the Altras, they have a wide toe box just like the Altras, but they have a better sole. I can't do 0 degrees stacks anymore. I feel like I'm walking on clouds. Will continue buying them as long as I can. Hopefully I find a store in Canada that carries them.

As always it’s very personal depending on how well the shoe fits my feet and the terrain I’m running in (technical mountains, mud, rocky). I like sky running races around 20-30k and VK’s. Sometimes short road races from 5k to Half Marathon. Current rotation: - Merrell Long Sky 2 Matryx. Great allrounder. - VJ Ultra 3. Cushion. Great for easy and long runs. - NNormal Kjerag Brut (mud) - Salomon Aero Glide 3 (road and treadmill) Recently retired shoes: - Nnormal Kjerag 1. Fast but too small lugs to have good grip in mud/loose debris. Too little cushion for me. Kjerag 2 has more cushion but same outsole. - Nnormal Tomir 2. Great allrounder but didn’t fit my feet (too little big toe space). A bit heavy when wet because the insole keeps a lot of water. - Salomon S/lab Genesis. Great allrounder but worse grip on wet rocks than Vibram Megagrip and VJ. - VJ Maxx 2. Really good allrounder. But didn’t fit my feet (too little big toe space). Shoes I’m considering next: - La Sportiva Prodigio Pro - Merrell MTL Adapt Matryx - Merrell Skyfire 2 Matryx

I am dealing with this right now. Shoes will only help so much. I am experimenting with an insole. And figuring out which shoe makes it flare the less. I’d have to look it the shoe I have been using has 2e. But I been, just started more less wearing. The new VJ Ultra 3. It has that fit lock lacing on the inside of the shoe to help stabilize the arch. I’m a couple runs in. And feels pretty good.

I have 77 miles in the VJ ultra 3 so far. I have not noticed any flattening out yet. I hope they stay springy. I really like the shoe. And would buy again as of today.

When I "technical trail" I winder what people mean because where I am at we have some black diamond shit. Wet, mossy rocks, mud, roots, more rocks and scree... we have everything except dry trails for 300+ days a year to put it into perspective. With that said I run in the following, ranked from most used to least... 1. Speedland GS GAR with some spikes added (3 on toe area and two all the way at the back) for a liiiitle extra grip on wet roots or rocks. I love these shoes for the wet, long run days. I leave the carbon plate out of these. 2. Speedland GL PDX: tempo/threshhold/ 5k, 10k even 20k but no more than that. Deeper lugs also helps when it gets really sloppy and also same spike arrangement added and I like the carbon plate in these. 3. VJ Ultra 3: Not the super deep lugs like the Inov8 shoes but amazing rubber and a really good wide toebox fit... at least by my standards. Hoka Tecton/x 3: On the dry days where the trails have had a couple days prior to really get things dry. I really love these shoes but they just don't have the traction for trails as technical as these. Hoka Zinal 2: For the short up's / hill races, hill sprints, etc. added a Sper Feet sole to these to add a little stiffness and protection. That's my quiver and my recommendations :) at least for trails...

okay, one brand no one has mentioned - Inov8. The mudclaw and mudtalon are great, althought rubber on the X-Talon Ultra wasnt great for wet obstacles or rocks in my experience. but if you want the best grip on the planet, buy some VJ Ultra / iRock / MAXx shoes. they are epic.

Hoka Mafate 5 is comfy and fun. Mafate Speed 4 is still good but a little narrower and not quite so bouncy. I used to run in Speedgoats a lot but think the 5 & 6 are missing some comfort and the foam isn’t returning the energy of newer shoes. Salomon Genesis or Ultra Glide are both good if you can accommodate a narrower fit. I prefer the protection of the Genesis over the Ultra Glide. Prodigio Pro is also fun and bouncy, but much lighter, less protection around the ankle and so a bit more stripped back. Everyone I know loves them though. Hoka Tecton X 3 is a similar proposition to the Prodigio but both are spendy. Hoka is slightly more stable and bouncy but there is very little in it. If you want the best outsole rubber money can buy, look at the VJ Ultra 3. Seriously, the lugs and rubber is like glue. Finally, the Saucony Xodus Ultra is a good shoe for distances like this. It’s also comfy and protective. Just avoid the 2 or 3 and go for the latest version 4.

Okay, so based on how you describe these issues, i think you have a pretty narrow foot, but i'm confused by the fact that you like the Hierro - this is pretty wide fitting and "plush" cushioned. SO maybe i have that wrong. But the best fitting shoes in the industry come from VJ. They have an amazing fitlock system which is peak stability. They have brilliant outsole rubber for technical trails, roots and wet rocks. They are epic for OCRs and orienteering. However, the midsole is usually a bit firm and numb, so they're not fit for road-to-trail. I've run in Ultra3 and Sparks, and if you're a lighter, smaller runner they will probably be fine. Alternatively, look at Salomon - the S/Lab Speed, Ultra, Genesis, etc are all narrow but have great lockdown. You have to persist with the lace system - sometimes you have to play with the lockdown 2-3 times before it all sits right, but I've loved running in the CDW Genesis for the last year.

As many people have said here, the SG6 is too firm and has lost some of its “fun”. The Merrell Agility Peak 5 is a good option. The Saucony Xodus Ultra 1 / 2 are great. Miss version 3. Version 4 is supposed to be a return to form. Salomon Genesis is a good shoe I’ve run 200km in but runs narrow. I am loving the Mafate 5 but it’s a marmite shoe for this community I’ve noticed. La Sportiva Prodigeo Pro has a lot of fans but the midsole is less stable, more bouncy and it’s not cheap. The North Face Vectiv Series are decent now - there’s a lot to choose from. Final option if you want great outsole grip is the VJ Ultra 3. Fab lockdown too.

I run a lot of the trails here in Kent where we have a mix of fields in deep mud, occasional footpaths and horse trails, and stretches of road to get from one to the next. The Inov8 shoes are good, but the midsole is pretty firm on the MudTalon and Trailtalon unless to take the Max options. Unless you want a really responsive shoe with a lot of ground feel then i'd avoid this. This also goes for some of the VJ Shoes (the iRock or XTRM have almost no midsole!). I really like VJ shoes for the traction though - the outsole is the best in the business. The VJ Maxx is a good choice. I like the VJ Ultra 3 although the midsole started to flatten out faster than i'd have liked. Brooks Cascadia i didn't get along with. Midsole was boring, the outsole not great, and the fit rubbed my little toes. I also think the Speedcross 6 is very firm, and a little treacherous on roads - those big lugs are great in the mud, but terrible on wet tarmac At the moment i am finding the Hoka Mafate 5 to be a good shoes with lots of bounce, and the lugs and rubber are giving me really good traction. But it's a heavier shoe thats really designed to half-marathon and upwards distance. Other shoes that I think might work for you: \- Hoka Mafate 5, VJ Ultra 3, Inov8 Trailfly Max \- Salomon Genesis or S/Lab Genesis \- Merrell Agility Peak 5 \- Saucony Peregrine or Xodus Ultra 4 (not the 3!) \- Asics Fujispeed or MetaFuji get good reviews, but i've not run in them yet

I have issues with overpronation and plantar fasciitis so I think I can empathise. I tried trail running for years with insoles but I’ve found that if you get proper orthotics (which you should) they are useful for road shoes and walking shoes, but they are not need when running cross country / trails. To a degree it depends on the trails you run. I do a lot of running on soft ground, mud, fields etc. so i look for a good stable neutral shoe. If I’m running on “fire tracks” or well worn, hard packed paths, with no technical requirements, then I usually go for a stable shoe and maybe use my orthotics if it’s the summer. My personal recommendations: - Hoka Mafate 5 - soft and bouncy but the platform is stable and it rewards you getting up on your toes - Salomon S/Lab Genesis - more narrow and nimble but still fine for the harder paths - Merrel Agility Peak 5 - moved to this off the Speedgoat as it’s still stable but more fun and comfy - VJ Ultra 3 - the midsole broke down quicker than I would have liked but the lockdown and outsole make it worth it for really tricky terrain.

VJ Ultra 3, superb grip, especially for wet stone